Treasure hunt success w/ pics

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BullDAWG
5+ Years
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Posts: 600
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2011 6:09 pm
Zip Code: 39401
Tractors Owned: 1950 Super A
1955 John Deere 60 (sold)
1950 Cub
1951 Cub (sold)
Tufline 5' disc (old heavy type)
1953+ A-295A 2 furrow SlatWing Plow Chief plow (SA)
1950 cub-193 1 furrow SWPC plow (cub)
5' home made bush hog mounts on drawbar
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: Treasure hunt success w/ pics

Postby BullDAWG » Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:18 pm

Waif wrote:
indy61 wrote:I believe there were some prototypes/experimental/pre production models as early as 1945. I've never heard of 1939 military Cubs.

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/Record ... cub&sort=5


I'm not discounting the 46 picture you linked to. Just sharing my own finds.(That did not turn up your picture!)

Nor claiming accuracy of the article linked below , but the "X" , had prototypes in 44 when the model became named the Cub.

It came at a time the manufacturer wanted to reduce lag time getting new models to market.
That hints of reduced testing of , (and in) markets by placing Cubs in varied hands to try out prototypes.
Pre 47 does not turn up models going anywhere beyond company grounds so far in my limited searches.

https://books.google.com/books?id=1rnv0 ... pe&f=false

Forgot name of the book but from same publishers, but it's a book strictly on Cubs and early cub cadets. And it talked about IH well before the war wanting to build cheaper and smaller tractors for the single horse/mule farmers and the Farmall x. He referenced other designs besides the cub and those saying there wasn't Cubs before 1947 never saw the 1945 commercial for the cub then. They had em in 45 and possibly before that. They had smaller rear tires and 15" front wheels. Also had different design of lift (like older Farmalls) so without a doubt they had em in 45. And unlike today with digital blueprints and computerized cnc machines they would have had to hand make them and change many things to make it more mass production friendly. That same book referenced cub x being built and design changes during the war. So I don't think a military prototype is a far reach. Now I also would like more info and check part #'s to make sure it's not from some old JD pony or similar AC etc. But was interesting to think about. But those that just want to quote when the first cub #501 was made haven't got a clue on how things worked back then. Hand made prototypes took thousands of man-hours to make and would be modified many times before a production model along with all the implements in 1947 would be ready. Many testing by famers and general public would have been normal then. Today computers can stress test them before they even make em but that's not how it worked in the 20's, 30's, 40s or even in the 70's. Now could it be I was looking at something not even a Farmall? Possibly. But what if..... It would be great finding the true history of the baby farmall. But to be honest I was more blown away by the 62 offset Ford 2000. Paint it red n remove the Ford in the grill and you would think it was a 100-140... I looked em up and had to laugh as a guy explained how it was designed for tobacco farmers and was a radical new design. With great view of crops while cultivating. Guess he never heard of cultavission or that Farmalls had offset tractors for over 25 years before Ford's great discovery... But they were rare and a cute knockoff lol they even had a red n gray version 541 I think was it in 59-61, the 2000 just had different grill/hood.
ImageCircle of Safety
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the GOVERNMENT and I'm here to HELP."
"I DON'T believe in a government that protects US from OURSELVES." R. Reagan

Bob McCarty
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Location: CO, Longmont

Re: Treasure hunt success w/ pics

Postby Bob McCarty » Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:42 pm

BullDAWG, Do you think you could get the owner to look for a part # and possibly send you some pictures? I would accept that maybe prototypes were being made that early, but I seriously doubt that anyone had projected the need for military Cubs in 1939 as the US didn't enter WW II until 1941.
"We don't need to think more,
we need to think differently."
-Albert Einstein

Waif
501 Club
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Posts: 705
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:29 pm
Zip Code: 49343
Tractors Owned: 48 Farmall Cub "Seen Yore Dobbin"
53 F-Cub W/Loader.
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Michigan

Re: Treasure hunt success w/ pics

Postby Waif » Thu Sep 27, 2018 3:56 pm

BullDAWG wrote:
Waif wrote:
indy61 wrote:I believe there were some prototypes/experimental/pre production models as early as 1945. I've never heard of 1939 military Cubs.

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/Record ... cub&sort=5


I'm not discounting the 46 picture you linked to. Just sharing my own finds.(That did not turn up your picture!)

Nor claiming accuracy of the article linked below , but the "X" , had prototypes in 44 when the model became named the Cub.

It came at a time the manufacturer wanted to reduce lag time getting new models to market.
That hints of reduced testing of , (and in) markets by placing Cubs in varied hands to try out prototypes.
Pre 47 does not turn up models going anywhere beyond company grounds so far in my limited searches.

https://books.google.com/books?id=1rnv0 ... pe&f=false

Forgot name of the book but from same publishers, but it's a book strictly on Cubs and early cub cadets. And it talked about IH well before the war wanting to build cheaper and smaller tractors for the single horse/mule farmers and the Farmall x. He referenced other designs besides the cub and those saying there wasn't Cubs before 1947 never saw the 1945 commercial for the cub then. They had em in 45 and possibly before that. They had smaller rear tires and 15" front wheels. Also had different design of lift (like older Farmalls) so without a doubt they had em in 45. And unlike today with digital blueprints and computerized cnc machines they would have had to hand make them and change many things to make it more mass production friendly. That same book referenced cub x being built and design changes during the war. So I don't think a military prototype is a far reach. Now I also would like more info and check part #'s to make sure it's not from some old JD pony or similar AC etc. But was interesting to think about. But those that just want to quote when the first cub #501 was made haven't got a clue on how things worked back then. Hand made prototypes took thousands of man-hours to make and would be modified many times before a production model along with all the implements in 1947 would be ready. Many testing by famers and general public would have been normal then. Today computers can stress test them before they even make em but that's not how it worked in the 20's, 30's, 40s or even in the 70's. Now could it be I was looking at something not even a Farmall? Possibly. But what if..... It would be great finding the true history of the baby farmall. But to be honest I was more blown away by the 62 offset Ford 2000. Paint it red n remove the Ford in the grill and you would think it was a 100-140... I looked em up and had to laugh as a guy explained how it was designed for tobacco farmers and was a radical new design. With great view of crops while cultivating. Guess he never heard of cultavission or that Farmalls had offset tractors for over 25 years before Ford's great discovery... But they were rare and a cute knockoff lol they even had a red n gray version 541 I think was it in 59-61, the 2000 just had different grill/hood.


There is a book titled International Harvester Experimental and Prototype Tractors that might be the one you mentioned.

Tractor history is always interesting.
Good luck on the transmission tube origin chase. A good pursuit to sort out.

Congrats on your Treasure hunt and new friend.
Old barns can hold both surprises and mysteries for sure. (!)

BullDAWG
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 600
Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2011 6:09 pm
Zip Code: 39401
Tractors Owned: 1950 Super A
1955 John Deere 60 (sold)
1950 Cub
1951 Cub (sold)
Tufline 5' disc (old heavy type)
1953+ A-295A 2 furrow SlatWing Plow Chief plow (SA)
1950 cub-193 1 furrow SWPC plow (cub)
5' home made bush hog mounts on drawbar
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: Treasure hunt success w/ pics

Postby BullDAWG » Thu Sep 27, 2018 6:53 pm

Bob McCarty wrote:BullDAWG, Do you think you could get the owner to look for a part # and possibly send you some pictures? I would accept that maybe prototypes were being made that early, but I seriously doubt that anyone had projected the need for military Cubs in 1939 as the US didn't enter WW II until 1941.

Can call em n try getting em to send some pictures.
ImageCircle of Safety
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the GOVERNMENT and I'm here to HELP."
"I DON'T believe in a government that protects US from OURSELVES." R. Reagan

Jim Becker
Team Cub
Team Cub
Posts: 14192
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2003 2:59 pm
Zip Code: 55319
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: MN

Re: Treasure hunt success w/ pics

Postby Jim Becker » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:35 pm

My RPM article last year said the first Cub prototypes were shown to company management in December 1944. I'm not at home, don't have any reference material here. I assure you I didn't make that up.


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