Stuck Clutch-again

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Ben B
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Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Ben B » Sun Mar 24, 2019 7:31 am

After setting in the barn since November with regular starts, I went to get the cub out of the barn on Wednesday. It fired on the first crank, which is awesome! But, the clutch is stuck again. It stuck a couple times last summer and I was able to break it loose by putting it in 3rd gear and cranking it, or by having someone push the clutch pedal and me taking a prybar and working it under the clutch disk and prying it loose from the flywheel.

Well, I wrestled it out of the barn and got it on open ground. Nothing will break it loose! Not up a steep hill with a load, and trying to pry it loose from the flywheel is breaking the lining off the clutch, but its not prying out from the flywheel. It almost acts like it is glued to it.

If anyone has any suggestions to an easy fix that I've overlooked please tell me. Otherwise, this tractor is getting split this week to find out why this thing keeps sticking.

Thanks for any suggestions!
Ben
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MiCarl
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby MiCarl » Sun Mar 24, 2019 8:03 am

Your post seems to imply that the throw out is working and the pressure plate is lifting off the clutch disc. Assuming that is right it almost has to be corrosion sticking the clutch disc to the flywheel or the clutch disc to the drive shaft.

Are you storing it in a damp location?
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seahaul
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby seahaul » Sun Mar 24, 2019 8:25 am

Try moving to an open area, put the tractor in gear and start it up. With the clutch pedal pushed down, step on the brakes hard, maybe on and off the brakes hard several times. It may take several attempts to break it loose.

Eugene
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Eugene » Sun Mar 24, 2019 8:49 am

Get 6 longer bolts, same size holding the pressure plate to flywheel. One at a time remove the original bolts and install the new bolts with enough threads attached to hold everything in place. Now pry the pressure plate from the clutch disk and the clutch disk from the flywheel.

Once free, reinstall original bolts.

Note, this is only a temporary fix. If you have the time, split the tractor.
I have an excuse. CRS.

Waif
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Waif » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:44 am

When you get it fixed....Store it with the clutch pedal depressed.

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ricky racer
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby ricky racer » Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:49 am

If you find out the problem and find a fix, post it so we can all learn from it.
I've only had one Cub with a stuck clutch. To break it free I started it in 3rd gear, depressed the clutch peddle and applied the brakes after a few tries, it broke free. I never had it stick again.
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Eugene
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Eugene » Sun Mar 24, 2019 11:55 am

The clutch was stuck on my standard Cub when I purchased it. Numerous attempts to free the clutch, finally had to split the tractor.
I have an excuse. CRS.

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Glen
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Glen » Sun Mar 24, 2019 4:03 pm

Hi,
My opinion is every brand of clutch disc lining is made of a little different materials, some stick to the plate or flywheel, and some don't stick. I've had a sticking one in the past on a truck.
If you take it apart, I would replace the clutch disc, with one from TM Tractor, or Case IH, and see if it works better.
You could sand the pressure plate and flywheel surfaces with fine sandpaper also.

You didn't say which Cub it is, I guess you have 2 Cubs. I don't know if you have an original disc, or if it's been replaced. The original Cub clutch discs I've had have never stuck. :)

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Ben B
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Ben B » Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:35 am

Thank you everyone for the replies. It's on my 77.

I tried every trick I know. Third gear stomping the brakes up a hill with the clutch pedal pushed in for about 15 minutes. It never gave at all. That's when I had my son hold the pedal down while I reached in the access hole and tried to pry it loose. That worked last summer, but it ain't working now.

I'm planning on going ahead and splitting it this week. I'm going to see what is going in in there, and order my parts after I've looked into it to see what all might need replaced. I'll take photos of it as I go. It may not need anything but sanding the flywheel, so I'm not ordering parts unless I need to.

I think this thing is a fluke. There's something going on that just doesn't happen. I talked to a tractor mechanic at Church yesterday and he believes it is because of excessive moisture in my barn. Well, when it rained like it did last summer, my barn floor stayed wet all year. Maybe that was the problem. But, it's the best I could do at that time. It's finally just now starting to dry up.
Bravo Romeo Bravo

Larry in WNY
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Larry in WNY » Tue Mar 26, 2019 7:28 am

I agree with Waif. When you are not using it, find a way to keep the clutch depressed (blocking, straps, rope). This will prevent the sticking problem if you continue to keep it in a wet environment.

Larry

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Ben B
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Ben B » Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:38 am

Here's the photos I promised of the stuck clutch. And, was it ever stuck! You can see that it was stuck to both the pressure plate and flywheel, and it tore loose the lining from the clutch completely on the flywheel when we removed the pressure plate. We finally got it all apart, and the clutch is the only thing that will need replaced after cleaning it all up.

And, we found the culprit too. Antifreeze leaked out of the hose on the radiator inlet, ran down the top of the head, and into the bell housing covering everything in it with antifreeze and rusting everything. There was a white and green trail left behind. The bottom hose clamp was loose allowing it to leak out.

We also found a badly worn rear seal that I am also replacing while we are in here doing the rest of this work. Luckily, I already had one of Tim's remanufactured rear seals on standby! This old seal will be making the trip to his place soon to get remanufactured as well.



Image



Image
Bravo Romeo Bravo

Jim Becker
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Jim Becker » Thu Mar 28, 2019 11:30 am

Ben B wrote:. . . And, we found the culprit too. Antifreeze leaked out of the hose on the radiator inlet, ran down the top of the head, and into the bell housing covering everything in it with antifreeze and rusting everything. There was a white and green trail left behind. The bottom hose clamp was loose allowing it to leak out. . . .

Not to say this couldn't be the root cause, but:

Even with a large leak near or from the head, it is hard to imagine much working its way inside the bell housing -- the only openings are on the bottom. Even a big oil leak at the crankshaft rarely gets much oil on the clutch facing, so seems unlikely much antifreeze could get on the clutch. You should look for a source of whatever you are finding in the clutch housing, separate from the antifreeze.

Are you sure the green you are seeing isn't from copper in the clutch lining? A clutch that has been stuck, pried loose, used some more, etc. could have thrown quite a few bits of lining material in all directions.

If you do have antifreeze everywhere, it shouldn't be causing a lot of rust. Antifreeze has rust inhibitors. If it caused rust, you need to rethink your maintenance schedule on antifreeze replacement. It is more likely rust was caused by moisture out of the air.

You could have an antifreeze leak that runs to the back of the engine etc. but have nothing to do with the clutch problem, so don't consider that leak to be proof something else isn't going on.

I'm just saying to recheck and make sure your identified root cause is correct. You don't want to miss something else that needs attention while it is open.

Waif
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Waif » Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:17 pm

Not saying this is the case...But there is a rule that states , dissimilar metals corrode when touching.

The rest of the picture shows humidity or water were involved over time. Enhancing the corrosion.(?)
Heck , big temp swings can cause condensation. Worse in poorly ventilated areas like inside the housing.

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Ben B
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Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Ben B » Fri Mar 29, 2019 4:23 am

Thanks everyone for the advice. I haven't had this tractor very long, and the previous owner didn't have it very long either. So, its history is largely unknown to me. But, while I have it split, I'm checking everything I can get to. I was aware of the leaking outlet hose on the engine because it was leaking down the front of the engine also. But, I thought I had fixed it. It will be fixed before I put it back together.

There's no leaks on the transmission seals that I can see looking down in tube, and the rear engine seal was leaking a little bit, and looked to be original. I have already changed the rear seal with a new one from TST. The oil pump housing is not leaking at all, so I'm leaving it alone. The bushing in the flywheel is still within tolerance, so I'm leaving it too. The only thing I'm waiting on is the clutch disk itself.

While it is split, I'm doing some upgrades and touch ups just to make it suit me better. And, I'll be going over everything while I have it apart. Any suggestions are always welcome!
Bravo Romeo Bravo

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Ben B
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Tractors Owned: 1950 Farmall Cub (post demo)
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Location: Southwest Virginia

Re: Stuck Clutch-again

Postby Ben B » Tue Apr 09, 2019 8:05 am

The clutch is now replaced with a new one from Hamilton Bob's Cubs. Yesterday I finished putting it back together and gave it a test drive and it did fine. Everything else was in good shape. The clutch disk was the only thing I had to replace. But, in the process the rear seal was renewed and the throw out bearing got a good lube. I also replaced the hydraulic fluid with new, so it's been a helpful thing for this to happen. It's gotten a lot of attention I normally would not have given it.
Bravo Romeo Bravo


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