Anti freeze and freeze up !

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Anti freeze and freeze up !

Postby countershaft » Thu Jan 15, 2004 7:38 pm

Since there is no water pump on the Cub and water is not circulated, it's my understanding, that you have to pre mix the two (water and anti-freeze) before filling the radiator , to have it provide the proper freeze protection. Now some say , "she's froze up", does that mean that the components were not properly mixed or that there was not enough anti freeze to the ratio ? And what danger is there to the engine block , if that occurs ? It will be -9 degrees here tonite . So we'll soon see .

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Postby Bigdog » Thu Jan 15, 2004 7:49 pm

Most likely the mix was not the correct ratio. 50 / 50 should do for most folks.
That's not to say that they weren't mixed well enough, though, if the mixture has been in the tractor for any length of time, it should be well mixed.
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Postby Dogman » Thu Jan 15, 2004 7:53 pm

When ever I hear the term

"she's froze up"

I take it as the engine has seized

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Postby S.H.A.F.T. » Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:11 pm

I agree, the term "froze up" has more to do with the engine being stuck or seized rather than actually frozen. To answer your other question regarding what would happen if an engine actually froze, well, you will probably need a new engine block. Water expands when it freezes and cast iron doesn't like that. If you don't have anti-freeze in your radiator, then just drain it. Heck, I'd even let the thing idle outside over night if I couldn't drain it until the morning.

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Postby George Willer » Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:29 pm

They were referring to an engine that has seized as others have said. As far as the other freezing is concerned, there's a built in warning system. It seems the radiator tank will warn of a solid freeze by displaying a horizontal crack first. The secondary warning will be a crosswise crack in the head. If these warnings aren't heeded, the engine is at risk! :shock:

I don't know how much sound they make when they let go. :wink:
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Postby Jim Becker » Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:31 pm

Don't antique car engines end up frozen and old tractor engines get stuck?

If you want some details on what happens to a Cub when the coolant freezes, check the ATIS Cub FAQ in the question about inspecting a tractor before you buy it.

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Postby parts man » Thu Jan 15, 2004 10:41 pm

I wouldn't recomend running the engine for long with th ecoolant frozen as it will overheat. The coolant in the engine may thaw, but not in the rad!!
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Re: Anti freeze and freeze up !

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Fri Jan 16, 2004 9:41 am

countershaft wrote:Since there is no water pump on the Cub and water is not circulated, it's my understanding, that you have to pre mix the two (water and anti-freeze) before filling the radiator , to have it provide the proper freeze protection.

If you aren't going to be running it right away after adding the antifreeze, yes you do need to mix it. Since a cub doesn't have a water pump the coolant isn't forced to circulate, but when it is running it is circulated by the old law of physics that states heat rises. If your coolant is not well mixed, though, it takes quite a bit of running to get it thoroughly mixed.

As to froze up, I define that by context. It can mean an engine that has been allowed to freeze, usually due to no, or not enough antifreeze in the coolant, but most of the time it is an engine that's seized and can't be turned. As Jim said, usually car engines freeze, and tractor engines stick. Why the difference, I don't know, unless it's because most car engines freeze from the pistons seizing to the walls, or from bearings seizing due to lubrication problems, while most tractors stick from rusting while setting.
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Postby artc » Fri Jan 16, 2004 10:04 am

as Bigdog said, mix antifreeze 50/50 for -40F or C protection. Read somewhere that 100% antifreeze freezes at -20F and the water actually lowers the freeze point. I keep an empty gallon antifreeze container on the shelf so that I can divide a new gallon and add water to both jugs. then i mark the containers mixed like you would do for 2 stroke gas.
any auto parts store has a <$10 dollar antifreeze tester, way cheaper than a radiater, radiater base casting, head, or block.

Course, in Rudi's part of the country, or Quebec actually, I've SEEN -55F as reported on the radio. No ill affects on my truck, i waited for warmer weather like -10 to attempt to start it, but snowmobiling for several days was out of the question!

The old mercury thermometers would just have a little ball of mercury in the bottom, as mercury freezes at -40 or so. :lol:
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Postby Oscar Meier » Fri Jan 16, 2004 10:27 am

A well mixed solution of 50/50 antifreeze & water should never freeze solid. You may get some ice formation in the mix; but, it sould never get anything more solid than slush.

The formation of slush is a process that seperates the water from the glycol and will tend to gather bigger and bigger areas of water the more the times the slush is produced. It's important, if you suspect you may have had the mixture freeze to a slush, to start the engine after that to re-mix the solution.

Really, your talking -26 or -27 to get a 50/50 mix to freeze to a slush. Not many of us here in the States ever see that kind of cold.

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