C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

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BIGHOSS
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C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby BIGHOSS » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:18 pm

This is for a regular non-fast hitch cub with an installed cultivator. Has anyone out there engineered a drawbar that can be used with the rear cultivator still installed? Lot of trouble to remove the cultivator and install the regular drawbar.

I am thinking of using a swinging drawbar, but with some support at the rear. Not clear yet how I could make it work.

Any thoughts?
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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby havoc1482 » Sat Aug 30, 2014 5:21 pm

Get another Cub?? :mrgreen:
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BIGHOSS
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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby BIGHOSS » Sat Aug 30, 2014 6:03 pm

Actually, I have two more with drawbars but I like a challenge.
We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give......Winston Churchill

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby ScottyD'sdad » Sat Aug 30, 2014 6:27 pm

havoc1482 wrote:Get another Cub?? :mrgreen:

My fix, too!
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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Jim Becker » Sat Aug 30, 2014 6:54 pm

4 bolts and 2 cotter pins a lot of trouble?

Except when you are starting out with very young crops, you need to remove the drawbar for crop clearance anyway.

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby BIGHOSS » Sat Aug 30, 2014 8:08 pm

Because of past life as an Industrial Engineer, I am always looking for the better way. :? :? :?
We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give......Winston Churchill

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Jim Becker » Sat Aug 30, 2014 10:27 pm

Then you must be familiar with the concept of cost vs. payback. :shock:

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby BIGHOSS » Sun Aug 31, 2014 6:17 am

Yeah Jim, we called that ROI (Return on Investment).
We make a living by what we get, but we make a life by what we give......Winston Churchill

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby PVF1799 » Sun Aug 31, 2014 7:41 pm

Sorry Gents I could not resist.

Let's consider the Economic Value Add (EVA) - whereby the investment must meet a 12% hurdle rate. Meaning if you'll be given $100 to do the project you'll only get the money for the Capital Expense if the EVA is 112% of the project cost. Oh, forgot to mention you must pay it all back in less than 24 months at that rate. I can send you a spreadsheet that calculates this over 10 years if you'd like.... :D :D :D

Been using the C144 since the 60's - Don't see how to do this - have it look nice and ensure it doesn't break a final drive casting.

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Smokeycub » Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:39 am

I'm thinking that ROI and the like is pretty much meaningless with regard to developing something like this for a Cub. More like a labor (or investment) of love! :lol: Since the drawbar needs to bolt in the same place as the rear cultivator tool bars then it seems one would need to build a narrower drawbar and custom make the drawbar brackets to accommodate the cast cultivator bracket. Doesn't seem too difficult, use one of your extra drawbars, narrow it (cut and splice perhaps), get creative with the torches and welder and build up the drawbar brackets (or make new ones) to fit over the cultivator brackets, allowing for the cultivators to move as needed. You could use the swinging drawbar as usual.
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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Scrivet » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:10 am

Cost vs payback.....ROI.....EVA.....If that's a requirement then I''m gonna have to get rid of some Cubs!

BIGHOSS, here's my 2 cents.
Make a bracket to fit between the final and the left and right bearing (had to look in the parts book for that name :lol: ) would need longer implement bolts I suspect. For these brackets think heavy wide angle iron with holes instead of slots for the bolts. Make sure they are far enough below the bearings and not far enough to the rear to interfere with the gang beams going up and down. The other angle of the "angle iron" should face inward. It needs to be farther in than the "elbow" in the gang beams to it's rear. On the ends of this horizontal "angle iron" place a square tube facing fore and aft, something like a 2" receiver hitch. Make/adapt a drawbar horseshoe shape with appropriate ends to fit in the "receiver" tubes.

Pull or insert two pins and your drawbar is on or off :{_}:

Jim won't even have found his wrench yet! :D :wink:

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Smokeycub » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:21 am

Scrivet wrote:On the ends of this horizontal "angle iron" place a square tube facing fore and aft, something like a 2" receiver hitch. Make/adapt a drawbar horseshoe shape with appropriate ends to fit in the "receiver" tubes. Pull or insert two pins and your drawbar is on or off

Now that's a good idea! I like it! :-:-):
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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Jim Becker » Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:07 am

Scrivet wrote:Make a bracket to fit between the final and the left and right bearing . . .
Pull or insert two pins and your drawbar is on or off

This is actually a pretty good approach to the idea, with a few reservations.

Scrivet wrote:For these brackets think heavy wide angle iron with holes instead of slots for the bolts. Make sure they are far enough below the bearings and not far enough to the rear to interfere with the gang beams going up and down.

Interfering with the gang beams won't be a problem. The shape of the bearings won't allow the angle iron to reach below or behind the final drive housing. The angle iron would be limited to up and forward. But only as far as the axle cap/seed plate drive. Be sure that the drawbar is long enough to reach back to the original drawbar's location to not create a tip over hazard.

Scrivet wrote:For these brackets think heavy wide angle iron with holes instead of slots for the bolts. . . . The other angle of the "angle iron" should face inward. It needs to be farther in than the "elbow" in the gang beams to it's rear.

By the time you have managed to scrounge an angle iron that big, I will have found my wrench. If you opt to simply buy it, it would probably be cheaper to buy another Cub.

Scrivet wrote:On the ends of this horizontal "angle iron" place a square tube facing fore and aft, something like a 2" receiver hitch. Make/adapt a drawbar horseshoe shape with appropriate ends to fit in the "receiver" tubes.

Bevel the inner edges of the tubes and the front ends of the horseshoe so you will still be able to hammer the drawbar in place after it bends a little (or warps slightly when welding it up). Make sure the two receiver tubes are perfectly coplanar and parallel or you will need the hammer anyway.


Scrivet wrote:The other angle of the "angle iron" should face inward. It needs to be farther in than the "elbow" in the gang beams to it's rear. On the ends of this horizontal "angle iron" place a square tube facing fore and aft, something like a 2" receiver hitch.

Don't forget to bevel all the edges so you don't tear up the tomato plants.

By the time you have this built, I could do 10 years worth of swapping the drawbar on and off.

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby Scrivet » Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:56 am

I used the term "think heavy wide angle iron" as a visual aid in what the bracket would look like. I wouldn't actually use angle iron as it would taper somewhat from the corner out to both edges. That would change the pivot of the bearing/gang beam to a couple degrees off horizontal and throw the far ends of the gang beams lower than the inside.

Good point about warping when welding. Build the brackets minus the receiver tubes. Build the drawbar, slide the receiver tubes into place on it. Weld it to the brackets installed on the tractor. As for bending, build it as heavy as the original drawbar and don't try to pull a house.

While I probably wouldn't bother with going to the effort to build this either (because I have other Cubs, and one thing that nobody has brought up yet) I see a lot of things I wouldn't do get done on this and other forums. I.E. joining two tractors, machining parts that can be bought easily, transplanting various engines in a Cub/other tractor, etc. etc. Just because I think it's impractical doesn't mean everyone else does as well. I look at it like my opinion on what color to paint your Cub, whatever makes you happy.

Oh Yeah; the "other thing nobody has brought up". Gonna really have to watch turning. No sharp turns or you'll put a pointed sweep in a rear tire :(

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Re: C-144 Cultivator/Drawbar

Postby danovercash » Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:57 am

Find a fast hitch, problem solved.
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