LED Headlight Bulbs

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Urbish
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LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Urbish » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:40 am

Has anybody sourced/tried 6V LED headlights for their Cub?

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Puffie40 » Mon Dec 07, 2015 10:34 am

I have briefly looked around for those. There is some mention of it in the vintage motorcycle forums about it, but I've never seen any physical attempts.

I read an issue with LED retrofits (ie the plug in taillight bulbs) is the incandescent reflectors dont work very well because of the limited cone of light the LED produces. This leads to a noticibly dimmer light.

I don't think modifying a LED worklight to run on 6v will be hard - LEDs are current devices so I imagine some resistors will need to be changed out- but if you want your original shells I'd consider moving the entire reflector assembly into it.

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:26 am

There are some companies that make them as specific replacements for the old bulbs, but unless you get the high priced ones at about $35 each they were polarity sensitive and would not work on + ground systems. If you have the old tear drop style lights it is pretty easy to replace them with a sealed beam that produces a lot more light than the originals. They do draw a little more current than the original, but unless you are running it a lot with the lights on that will not make a difference.
viewtopic.php?f=140&t=70780
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Urbish » Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:21 pm

Thanks for the info. When I'm plowing snow, it is usually dark and I use my rear light as well. With all three on, I am using most of my available 10A and drop down to a discharge condition when idling. This hasn't really been a problem as I have a newer battery and have never run it down. I was just curious if I could get brighter lights while working within the limits of the charging system. I'll just stick with what I have for now.
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Puffie40 » Mon Dec 07, 2015 5:55 pm

John *.?-!.* cub owner wrote:There are some companies that make them as specific replacements for the old bulbs, but unless you get the high priced ones at about $35 each they were polarity sensitive and would not work on + ground systems. If you have the old tear drop style lights it is pretty easy to replace them with a sealed beam that produces a lot more light than the originals. They do draw a little more current than the original, but unless you are running it a lot with the lights on that will not make a difference.
http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewto ... 40&t=70780


That may not be an issue as positive ground just means the wire on the lights needs to be reversed for the LEDs to work (that is assuming there are no polarized caps or IC chips inside used to adjust the voltage).

It's possible, but at the moment it needs some electronic skills to cook your own up.

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby DRaymond » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:00 pm

One thing I am going to explore at a Motorcycle shop or trailer supply store would be to see if there might be a way to possibly adapt LED bulbs to go into the headlight & tail light assemblies at the voltage I would need. That will be a later research project for me. Maybe someone has already looked into LED bulbs?
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:50 pm

Puffie40 wrote:.....
That may not be an issue as positive ground just means the wire on the lights needs to be reversed for the LEDs to work (that is assuming there are no polarized caps or IC chips inside used to adjust the voltage).

It's possible, but at the moment it needs some electronic skills to cook your own up.
Agreed, if you get bulbs with wires on them, but if you get bulbs to fit the existing socket the socket shell is also mounted to the tractor and is the ground. To reverse that you would have to isolate the shell and rewire, or else reverse the battery and ammeter connections, then repolarize the generator.
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby bob in CT » Tue Dec 29, 2015 11:18 pm

John *.?-!.* cub owner wrote:There are some companies that make them as specific replacements for the old bulbs, but unless you get the high priced ones at about $35 each they were polarity sensitive and would not work on + ground systems. If you have the old tear drop style lights it is pretty easy to replace them with a sealed beam that produces a lot more light than the originals. They do draw a little more current than the original, but unless you are running it a lot with the lights on that will not make a difference.
viewtopic.php?f=140&t=70780

Here is a LED light that comes in 4.5" which I think the lamp you used is. Comes in spot, 60 degree flood, and trapezoid. Lots more high color temp light and less current. Looks like a good choice for a 12v conversion.

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https://www.larsenlights.com/par-36-45-18-watt-flood-light

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Bus Driver » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:21 am

Have been studying this issue for some of my cars. In geometry, the perfect parabola has a point as the focus. For some purposes, the parabola is the perfect light reflector. By definition, a point has no dimensions, only location. But man-made light sources are not point sources. An incandescent filament has length, so it is not a perfect point. Low voltage filaments are shorter and thus are nearer to being point sources. Note that accent lighting is often low voltage. 6 and 12 are considered to be low voltages.
LEDs are often placed so that they are spread around. So effective reflectors for LEDs are not likely to be those used for incandescents.
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby bob in CT » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:46 am

Here is a nice web page that shows you what the different beams offered above will look like in practice. Scroll down for the tractor and implement patterns.

http://www.blazer-international.com/beampatterns.php

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Jim Becker » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:18 pm

One fundamental difference between an incandescent light and an LED is directionality of the light. An incandescent filament throws nearly the same light in all directions (subject to some variation due to length of the filament and the filament support structure). Thus the parabolic reflector is needed to redirect about half the light that is headed totally the wrong way. The part of the light that just barely misses the reflector creates "scatter" and is, for all practical purposes lost energy.

LEDs, on the other hand, produce light that is already directional. For all practical purposes, you can consider each individual LED in a cluster as being a complete light with a built in reflector. Thus, a lamp like the one in Bob's post is packaged to fit the same mounting as a conventional par36 lamp but doesn't actually have a reflector similar to a conventional par36. (Look at the picture of the back side.)

One implication of this is that one needs to be careful in using an LED replacement for individual bulbs like the venerable 1157. The LED projects most light out the tip of the bulb. Many tail light assemblies mount the bulb horizontally pointing straight back and work fine with LEDs. Others mount the bulb sideways or near vertically which would project the light at the housing and loose much of it.

Side note, conventional high/low sealed beam units redirect the beam according to each filament's position inside the unit. The filaments can't both be at the focal point of the reflector. I don't know whether the traditional design put both equally near the focus (probably) or put the high beam on focus. But many years ago one of the bulb companies made a big deal of placing the low beam filament at the focal point to reduce scatter and improve lighting when facing oncoming traffic.

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Urbish » Wed Dec 30, 2015 1:38 pm

I found these: http://www.ledtronics.com/Products/prod ... ED%20Bulbs They're 25º throw spotlights though. Hmmm.

Right above the specs, it says "Indoor Applications only like Downlights, Spotlights." Might not be what we need for a Cub.

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby Flyboy » Tue Jan 05, 2016 7:35 pm

I am also a night snow plower. I looked into the LED retro thing and wasn't able to find anything that would be easily adaptable. I have decided to build a tray for a 12 volt battery that can be attached (and rest on) the drawbar. I am going to try to find some clamp on LED lights that I can clip to the plow and one for the back of the tractor. When done, I can use a 12 v trickle charger to recharge the battery. This way, I can leave the factory lights alone, and add/remove from the tractor easily when I don't need it.

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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby inairam » Tue Jan 05, 2016 8:11 pm

I have been thinking about LEDs and i also have 6 volt systems on my tractors. At work we are always working with ac and dc transformers. There are 6-12 volt step up transformers. this would give you a 12 v circuit on the tractor for your led light bar without the extra battery and charger. This one is expensive. I have seen less expensive ones. I have seen some antique car sites that talk about using step up transformers 12 v radios and other things.
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Re: LED Headlight Bulbs

Postby bob in CT » Tue Jan 05, 2016 9:21 pm

Those PAR36 LED lights in 6 or 12V will work fine if you use John's method of adapting a sealed to the larger teardrop light. A lot easier than step-up transformers and extra batteries.


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