This site uses cookies to maintain login information on FarmallCub.Com. Click the X in the banner upper right corner to close this notice. For more information on our privacy policy, visit this link:
Privacy Policy

NEW REGISTERED MEMBERS: Be sure to check your SPAM/JUNK folders for the activation email.

Valve/block issue - update

The Cub Club -- Questions and answers to all of your Cub related issues.
Forum rules
Notice: For sale and wanted posts are not allowed in this forum. Please use our free classifieds or one of our site sponsors for your tractor and parts needs.
User avatar
Ken (48 Cub)
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 994
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2003 11:10 am
Zip Code: 40023
Tractors Owned: 1948 FCub
1957 LoBoy
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: KY, Fisherville

Valve/block issue - update

Postby Ken (48 Cub) » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:13 pm

Working on the 57 lowboy. Tractor runs good with very minor blow by until I engage the PTO with C3 belly mower attached. The valves immediately chatter loudly and there is major blow by. The tractor also gets very hot and will die unless I disengage the PTO.

So I decided the remove the valve cover and take a look...I did not like what I found.
Can someone post a picture of what the block should look like here?

IMG_20170228_162421764.jpg

IMG_20170228_162421764.jpg

IMG_20170228_162438640.jpg

IMG_20170228_162445011.jpg


The engine casting code is - 11-27-C I think.
IMG_20170228_154659395 - Copy.jpg


Anybody ever seen this kind of damage before? Is this block junk?

I tore the engine down today to get a closer look. NO metal pieces in the oil pan. So some cleaned up their mess. This damage looks intentional to me. The holes are very uniform. A PO modification maybe... The engine turns over smoothly with the hand crank. A mystery I guess. :)

Here are a couple more pictures of the valves and head.

IMG_20170301_133348165.jpg

IMG_20170301_151652498_HDR.jpg
Attachments
IMG_20170228_162411324.jpg
Last edited by Ken (48 Cub) on Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ken, Annie the '48.

I think we gotter if'n she don't jump, Andy Griffith.

SPONSOR AD

Sponsor



Sponsor
 

User avatar
Bill V in Md
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 1109
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2003 6:51 pm
Zip Code: 21228
Tractors Owned: 1948 Farmall Cub
LT1045 Cub Cadet
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: MD, Catonsville
Contact:

Re: Valve/block issue

Postby Bill V in Md » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:29 pm

Ken, this photo is from my 1948 Cub engine.
Valves_Seal Plug1.jpg
Bill VanHooser
Cub 54 Blade, Cub 193 Moldboard Plow, Cub 28A Disc Harrow
Circle of Safety

Eugene
Team Cub Mentor
Team Cub Mentor
Posts: 20336
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2004 9:52 pm
Zip Code: 65051
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Mo. Linn

Re: Valve/block issue

Postby Eugene » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:37 pm

Ken (48 Cub) wrote:Anybody ever seen this kind of damage before? Is this block junk?
No to first question. Yes to second question.
I have an excuse. CRS.

User avatar
Ken (48 Cub)
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 994
Joined: Mon Feb 03, 2003 11:10 am
Zip Code: 40023
Tractors Owned: 1948 FCub
1957 LoBoy
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: KY, Fisherville

Re: Valve/block issue

Postby Ken (48 Cub) » Tue Feb 28, 2017 5:39 pm

Thanks Bill and Eugene...that's what I was afraid of.
Ken, Annie the '48.

I think we gotter if'n she don't jump, Andy Griffith.

Jim Becker
Team Cub
Team Cub
Posts: 17214
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2003 2:59 pm
Zip Code: 55319
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: MN

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Jim Becker » Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:30 pm

Sometimes it is hard to tell if a part is damaged from looking at a picture, heck sometimes even with the part in hand, particularly when looking at the jagged edges that were made as part of a casting. In this case, the holes are there for oil to drain back to the pan. Whether some critical material has broken loose is hard to tell. Are there any jagged edges where something broke? Most of the edges look to me like they have the original glyptal coating in place. Besides, both holes look about the same, seems unlikely both would have similar damage.

I am not convinced anything is wrong with this block. In any case, I don't see how this would explain your current problem. Are you sure the chatter is from the valves? Exactly what symptom are you seeing of overheating? How quickly does it happen?

BigBill
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 7388
Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2006 5:02 pm
Zip Code: 00000
Location: in northern usa

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby BigBill » Wed Mar 01, 2017 10:53 pm

Looks like the sand casting bled into the castiron block in that area. Maybe this one missed the deburing process at the factory.
In our drag race engines we use a handgrinder with a rotary file to remove those sharp ragged edges to improve the return oil flow.

Ot,, when I was working for American motors I had one of those Mr machine 390 4 speed cars come in on warranty. Running very bad with very low oil pressure running on seven cylinders.
I dropped the oil pan right away playing on my gut feeling. I found pieces of a cracked lifter in the oil pan. I inspected the camshaft and all was good. I installed a new lifter and off she went. I expected this 390 to fly. Great looking car but it was a dog.
I'm technically misunderstood at times i guess its been this way my whole life so why should it change now.

User avatar
Slim140
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 4908
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140
1972 International 140
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Slim140 » Thu Mar 02, 2017 7:46 am

I agree with Jim, not sure there's anything wrong with your block. I can't find a picture of the engine on the Cub I recently rebuilt with all the components in it but I did find this one and the holes look close to what you have.
Attachments
IMG_9091.JPG
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

tst
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 5183
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:08 pm
Zip Code: 12514
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby tst » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:15 am

some castings are not as nice as others, there is nothing wrong with that block

Clip
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 230
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:18 am
Zip Code: 28479
Circle of Safety: Y

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Clip » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:18 am

I've studied the pictures for three days now and can't find anything different than my block. My block looks almost exactly the same, with rough edges from the casting process. Wish I had some pictures from last time I had the valve cover off.

Gary Dotson
Team Cub Mentor
Team Cub Mentor
Posts: 5609
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 6:20 am
Zip Code: 43358
Tractors Owned: 48 Cub Diesel (Cubota)
53 Cockshutt 20 restored (Shooter)
52 Cockshutt 20 unrestored
47 Leader "B" (Herckie)
49 Leader "D" (Princess)
49 Leader "D" very rough
48 Leader "D" unrestored
Kubota B6200E
Kubota B6200HST
Kubota B8200HST-D
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: OH West Mansfield

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Gary Dotson » Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:27 am

I too was questioning whether that was damage or not. First off, I can't envision how a block would receive damage of this nature and then to have the same damage in two locations is just a bit too much. I'm not sure the drain back holes are usually quite so large, so it looks a bit odd but I don't see it as damage.

Waif
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 1138
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:29 pm
Zip Code: 49343
Tractors Owned: 48 Farmall Cub "Seen Yore Dobbin"
53 F-Cub W/Loader.
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Michigan

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Waif » Thu Mar 02, 2017 10:53 am

Good oil pressure?
Is it for sure valve train noise?
Were compression tests run before tear down?

Adding a load and blow by increasing hints of rings or cylinder issues ....maybe.

User avatar
Bigdog
Team Cub Mentor
Team Cub Mentor
Posts: 24144
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2003 12:50 pm
Zip Code: 43113
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: OH, Circleville
Contact:

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Bigdog » Thu Mar 02, 2017 10:59 am

Wrist pin noise or possibly rod noise?
Bigdog
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem.

My wife says I don't listen to her. - - - - - - - - Or something like that!

Image

http://www.cubtug.com

inairam
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 2803
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:24 am
Zip Code: 19342
Tractors Owned: 1948 6v - Dozer
1949 with kub klipper belly mower. mag 6v - Mom
1950 with plow, 54 blade, mott mag 6v - Roxanne
1953 54 blade, c22, wood 42 6v
1957 6v - barn Queen
1965 lo-boy with c-3 mower 12 v - Loboy
1974 Horse II 12 v c-2
1975 with woods 42-6 12 v - Horse
1979 long strip 12 v stuck engine
130 with international 1000 loader 6 v
1969 140 with bush hog tow behind mower 12 v
Terramite T-6 4WD Backhoe Perkins diesel
Memberships: Rough and Tumble Engineers Historical Association;Chapter 8 IH Collectors; IH Collectors Worldwide
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Glen Mills PA

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby inairam » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:26 am

The hole are cast in oil returns, not a mod or defect. I have to admit I was concerned when I first say them.
Last edited by inairam on Thu Mar 02, 2017 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
When you only have 9 horsepower you need to know the names of all of the ponies!

User avatar
ricky racer
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 6303
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:40 pm
Zip Code: 49120
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Niles / Buchanan, Michigan

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby ricky racer » Thu Mar 02, 2017 12:15 pm

Jim Becker wrote:Sometimes it is hard to tell if a part is damaged from looking at a picture, heck sometimes even with the part in hand, particularly when looking at the jagged edges that were made as part of a casting. In this case, the holes are there for oil to drain back to the pan. Whether some critical material has broken loose is hard to tell. Are there any jagged edges where something broke? Most of the edges look to me like they have the original glyptal coating in place. Besides, both holes look about the same, seems unlikely both would have similar damage.

I am not convinced anything is wrong with this block. In any case, I don't see how this would explain your current problem. Are you sure the chatter is from the valves? Exactly what symptom are you seeing of overheating? How quickly does it happen?


I have seen this before and agree with Jim, I see nothing wrong with the block. The reason you didn't find any material in the oil pan is because its been like that since it came from the factory.
1929 Farmall Regular
1935 John Deere B
1937 John Deere A
1941 John Deere H
1952 John Deere B
1953 Farmall Cub

Alan Riley
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 449
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:49 pm
Zip Code: 71328
Location: LA, Deville

Re: Valve/block issue - update

Postby Alan Riley » Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:14 pm

Here's a picture of my block. It has the same ragged edges on the casting.

Cub block.jpg
Old Age: The phase of life when nothing works and everything hurts...


Return to “Farmall Cub”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 26 guests