Running Rough

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Bud-in-PA
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 9:09 am
Zip Code: 15330
Tractors Owned: 1955 Cub Lo-boy (SN 1769 J), 1973 Massey Ferguson 165 Row Crop, 1989 Kubota L3250 TLB, 1947 Ferguson TE-20

Re: Running Rough

Postby Bud-in-PA » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:08 pm

You might want to check the condition of your battery. If you have some kind of electrical problem (ie., the pegged ammeter) which has discharged your battery this could easily give you the symptoms you're seeing. Just a thought.
1955 Cub Lo-boy, 1973 Massey Ferguson 165 Row Crop,
1989 Kubota L3250 TLB, 1947 Ferguson TE-20

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:50 pm

Well, pulled the hood and pulled the plugs. They seem pretty old...never heard of Denso...in any event 2 of them were pretty black and carboned up so I bought a set of Autolite 3116's. Could someone provide the correct gap please.
Time to rewire to solve the drain issue, put in the correct light switch and wire the back light...and give the generator a once over. I did notice the generator belt is cracked and coming apart. To remove the belt, is it the the big nut behind the pulley that needs to be removed to replace the belt? Hoping it is pretty simple.

staninlowerAL
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 3131
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:34 pm
Zip Code: 36558
Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: AL (Southwest)

Re: Running Rough

Postby staninlowerAL » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:06 pm

DO NOT try to turn the nut on the fan shaft, you could break the "fork" that the shaft is connected on to. Hold the nut and use an open end wrench to turn the fan shaft. The shaft has "flats" made into the shaft to fit the wrench. When you get the fan shaft loose it will slide down in the "fork" to give slack to remove the belt. You will have to work the belt off over the fan and from the shroud. It's a tight fit but it can be done.

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:15 pm

Do you have to remove the fan housing to get at the shaft flats?
Here is the plug pic.
Attachments
Lorelei plugs resized.jpg

staninlowerAL
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 3131
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:34 pm
Zip Code: 36558
Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: AL (Southwest)

Re: Running Rough

Postby staninlowerAL » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:23 pm

The shaft flats are at the rear end of the shaft next to the "fork". You might have to grind down a wrench to make it thin enough to go in and fit. Try a search, I can't remember if it's 13/16 or 11/16.

staninlowerAL
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 3131
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:34 pm
Zip Code: 36558
Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: AL (Southwest)

Re: Running Rough

Postby staninlowerAL » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:27 pm

Try this link. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=96437&hilit=fan+shaft+wrench Dale says it's 13/16.

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:41 pm

Can you get the 2 belts at NAPA? Might as well replace both while everything is open. Spark plug gap?

User avatar
Glen
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 2311
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:33 pm
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: 1956 Farmall Cub with Fast Hitch, F-11 plow, Disc, Cultivator, Cub-22 mower
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Wa.

Re: Running Rough

Postby Glen » Sun Sep 10, 2017 1:33 am

Hi,
The Cub owner's manual has info about adjusting and replacing the fan and generator belts.
The 6 sided place for the wrench is just to the rear of the generator pulley on the fan shaft.

You don't take the shroud off the radiator. The belts work off over the fan blades one at a time.
You can buy new belts at NAPA, I don't have the part numbers. The fan belt should be the right length so the fan shaft is a little below half way up the slots that hold the assembly in place. That is how the belt from Case IH is made to fit.
The fan should not be high up in the shroud.

The first page shows the belt tension.

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... e%2034.jpg

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... e%2035.jpg

The generator belt should be the right length, so the bolt in the top adjustment slot is in towards the engine.

The spark plug gap is in the Cub owner's manual, it is .023".
Below is a page showing it. :)

http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.clea ... e%2037.jpg

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:26 pm

Thank you for the tips and BY, the video was a great help...the 2 belts are changed. Changed both as they were both in tough shape. Onward. Got the generator apart...See the pics and advise. How would one know that the brushes are okay? Also, the windings around the body (the thick part and the thinner part) they are dull and I am wondering if they need to be polished. Also, there are what appear to be 2 concave circular copper pieces in the body of the generator. Do they need to be polished?
Attachments
Generator Windings resized.jpg
Generator Inside resized.jpg
Generator Brushes resized.jpg

User avatar
Glen
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 2311
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:33 pm
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: 1956 Farmall Cub with Fast Hitch, F-11 plow, Disc, Cultivator, Cub-22 mower
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Wa.

Re: Running Rough

Postby Glen » Sun Sep 10, 2017 6:00 pm

Hi,
Glad you got the belts changed.

The brushes look good still. You tell if they need replacing by the length of them, if they are worn short, then they need replacing. Those in your pic look good, almost new length.
The gen looks fairly clean inside, someone might have had it apart not long ago, one brush has a different name than Delco on it, in the pic, I think.
I would use the brushes more, if they are not broken, or anything wrong with them, their length is good.
The commutator needs polishing, that is the copper colored area at the rear end of the armature. Use some very fine sandpaper, 400 grit, or finer, by hand, and shine it up. Wipe off all sanding with a clean rag when done.
You could also sand the ends of the brushes that run on the commutator a little, and clean them.
Just wipe off everything inside the case, and the armature with a clean rag, no need to polish inside the case, if there is no rust.
Don't soak the armature, or inside the case with solvent.

Remove the band from the case, you will need it off to reassemble the brushes, when putting it together.
The end of the band goes at the bottom when putting it on again, but the end has to be turned a little out of the way of the rear bolt that holds the gen to the bracket.

The front bearing and the rear bushing need to be in good condition, and not worn.
To check the bushing, put the armature into the rear bushing while the rear end is off, and
twist the end some, and check for wear. If the bushing is worn, it needs replacing, so the armature does not rub on the magnets.
Twist the front end on the armature, and see if the bearing is loose, or still good.
Put some motor oil on the end of the shaft, and in the bushing when putting it together the last time. :)

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:03 pm

Awesome. I thought I might have to cobble together the generator with parts from my two (have a extra from the 12V conversion on the Loboy). Good news. When I get it together, how would I bench test if at all?

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:07 pm

what is the thicker part that is encased in copper as well? Also, what about the 2 convex parts in the housing...do they need cleaning as well?

staninlowerAL
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 3131
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:34 pm
Zip Code: 36558
Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: AL (Southwest)

Re: Running Rough

Postby staninlowerAL » Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:19 pm

The thicker part of the armature only needs to be wiped clean and not touching anything else when assembled. The 2 parts inside the housing is the magnetic field coils and wiped clean also. As Glen said the bearings/bushings keep the armature suspended between the magnetic field coils so the generator will work. If the two contact each other while running they will damage each other and the generator will not work.

ajhbike
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:06 pm
Zip Code: 06405
Tractors Owned: 1957 Cub- Lorelai
1956 Lo-Boy FH- Rory
1951 Super C FH- Emily
Woods 59 CLF
54A Blade
54-L Blade
C-22 Sickle Mower
72" Rear Blade, Carryalls, Pallet Forks, IH 263 2 Row Cultivator, Southeast 7' Rake, IM 500 Brush Hog, Horn-Draulic FEL
Location: Branford, CT

Re: Running Rough

Postby ajhbike » Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:28 pm

While I have everything apart, I am taking off all the moounting plates/brackets for the coil, VR, generator etc. to sand them up because I read in previous posts that these need a good contact ground.

User avatar
Glen
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 2311
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:33 pm
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: 1956 Farmall Cub with Fast Hitch, F-11 plow, Disc, Cultivator, Cub-22 mower
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Wa.

Re: Running Rough

Postby Glen » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:25 pm

Hi,
Yes, it's good to clean the mounting brackets so they ground.

Below is a pic of new brushes for the generator, so you can see the length. They are turned sideways in the pic. The bottom end of them is made at an angle for the commutator.
The brushes you have are almost the length of the new ones. :)
Attachments
Cub gen brushes.jpg
Cub gen brushes.jpg (20.41 KiB) Viewed 159 times


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