Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

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k hutchins
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:00 am

Thanks everyone for the input and information.
Eugene, I will definitely chk for bubbles, but what does that really tell me except confirming I need a new gasket?
Don, I may order a set when I get the gasket, just to be on the safe side.
As far as a compression chk, I already know that #3 is probably in need of new rings because the plug fouls more than the rest, and yes it burns a little oil as well. That is a little deeper than I want to dig at this point. As I said previously, for 70 yrs old it runs like a champ, it starts with just a touch of the starter rod (or crank if the battery is dead), and I'm afraid if I do one thing, that will lead to something else and I'll end up with falling dominoes. I can't have it out of service that long.
I'll get the gasket and bolts ordered, then up date progress.

Once again my thanks to all.
Hutch
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

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LRiddle
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby LRiddle » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:04 am

The bubbles in the coolant would be exhaust gasses going through the broken head gasket into the coolant passages and working their way to the radiator.
Luke Riddle
Tallmadge, Ohio
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k hutchins
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Original manuals for all the above

Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:13 pm

Ok everyone here is another question.
Should I flush the cooling system before or after I change the head gasket?
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby ntrenn » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:47 pm

While you are doing the head gasket. You will have access to the water jacket at that time. For not a whole lot more time you can touch up the valves and get a good adjustment too...i know....mission creep....you are taking the hood off...you can't eat just one....name your excuse...its going to happen...just plan for it...

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Dusty B
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Dusty B » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:02 pm

I know I'm a dummy, but to me any oil going into the combustion chamber would be burnt and show blue smoke from the exhaust, not pushed into the coolant!?!? Even oil entering thru the valve guides would show smoke to my thinking?! A leak somewhere that the oil passages & cooling passages cross would be my guess -(and I have NO IDEA where that might be!!). Ditto to Jim's recommend to check head flatness if you go that route tho!! Dusty B
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Dusty B » Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:45 pm

Don't know why my reply didn't post?? My 2cents - Iff. oil is getting into the cyl, would think there would be smoke?, getting in thru valve guides? didn't know oil passages ran thru head? (or close). Where do oil passages and coolant passages cross?? Curious to see result?? ! Dusty B
Grandpa's '41 B
'56,,'57,'59,'71 Cub
'51 Super C
'55 Case SC
Fairbanks-Morse 3KW Generator
Dad's DB garden tractor
'48 DeSoto
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Dusty B
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Dusty B » Sun Oct 22, 2017 12:46 pm

Dusty B wrote:Don't know why my reply didn't post?? My 2cents - Iff. oil is getting into the cyl, would think there would be smoke?, getting in thru valve guides? didn't know oil passages ran thru head? (or close). Where do oil passages and coolant passages cross?? Curious to see result?? ! Dusty B

My bad! - it did!! Sorry!
Grandpa's '41 B
'56,,'57,'59,'71 Cub
'51 Super C
'55 Case SC
Fairbanks-Morse 3KW Generator
Dad's DB garden tractor
'48 DeSoto
'31 "A Coupe
'51 Ford PU
'55 Dodge PU
God looks out for those of us who don't know how to look out for ourselves!

k hutchins
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Tractors Owned: 1948 Farmall Cub
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Cub 172 one row planter
Original manuals for all the above

Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Wed Nov 01, 2017 6:43 pm

Ok guys, I got my head gasket and bolts today, plan on tearing into it this weekend.

I did a radiator flush last weekend when I was mowing, and also checked when it was at running temp and no bubbles were visible in the radiator. So I guess the oil isn't coming from the combustion side.
I guess I won't really know until I get the head pulled and get a good look.
Could oil be getting into the bolster somehow? I checked the steering reservoir and that oil is clean and full. So no leakage between there and the radiator base.
One final question (for now) I have an old shop guild that says head bolts should be tightened to 45 ft/lbs. I have seen other threads where it has been mentioned that different bolts have different torque specs. Hopefully Glen can furnish the right page or thread with the needed info and save me time searching on my own.
Thanks everyone for your input and feedback up to this point, keep fingers crossed I'm going in.
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby LRiddle » Wed Nov 01, 2017 9:25 pm

Torque spec in the manual say 45. Go in steps as you do it too. I torqued all mine to 25 then went up to 35 and finally stepped up to 45.
Luke Riddle
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Glen
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Glen » Wed Nov 01, 2017 11:12 pm

Hi,
Before you put the head on, I would check the block surface, and the head surface with a straight edge, to be sure they are flat.
I would check all the head bolt holes. Run a tap in them and be sure they are clean. Then run a die on all the head bolts, if you are reusing them. Then turn the bolts into the holes by hand, and see if they all screw in easily. They have to turn easily to get an accurate torquing.
I would turn new bolts in the holes too, the threads can have defects. Turn a die on the bolts if needed, to improve the threads.

The head bolt threads need sealer, they go into the water jacket.
I use Permatex Aviation Form A Gasket, it is a liquid, non hardening sealer. It comes in a little can with an applicator brush made in the lid. If you buy one, stir it up well with a screwdriver or something, it settles in the bottom of the can some, sitting around. They have it at NAPA here in the west USA.

Some of the guys on here would probably say since you have a problem with the head sealing, to use the Copper Coat spray sealer on the new head gasket, both sides, before putting it together. Below is a pic of it. They might have it at NAPA also.

Clean everything well, the flat surfaces, and all the carbon from the piston tops, and valves.
When done cleaning, use paint thinner on a clean rag, and remove all oil from the flat surfaces of the block and head, so the Copper Coat will seal. Let the surfaces dry before putting the head on, use air if needed, wear your safety goggles when using the air.

Below is a page from the Cub service manual, GSS-1411, showing the head torque sequence, and torque. They have the manual at the top left of the page, at Quick links.

http://www.farmallcub.info/manuals/gss- ... 001-14.jpg

You will probably need a new gasket for the water elbow on the head, and maybe a new hose there too.
Below are listings at TM Tractor for them, or you can make a new gasket from gasket material.
It gives the sizes of the hose in the listing, they can probably cut a piece the right length at NAPA. If the clamps are old and don't turn easily, new ones are good to put on. :)

http://www.tmtractor.com/new/en/398fp.htm

http://www.tmtractor.com/new/hc/342fp.htm
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Cubfriend
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Cubfriend » Thu Nov 02, 2017 5:38 am

The recommendation above to put Seafoam on top of each cylinder overnight might help remove some carbon that may be sticking the rings on your #3 cylinder that has lower compression. May help even out your compression after 70 years of carbon buildup around the rings. It doesn’t cost much while the head is off or even putting it through the spark plug hole. Keep that engine running at it’s peak performance. There are only 9 horses, keep them all running! Good Luck, Frank
Frank

k hutchins
5+ Years
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Posts: 279
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:48 pm
Zip Code: 48843
Tractors Owned: 1948 Farmall Cub
193 plow
1948 snow/grading blade
Woods 59 C3
Cub 144 cultivator
Cub 22 mower
Cub 172 one row planter
Original manuals for all the above

Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Thu Nov 02, 2017 8:49 am

Thanks LR, kinda like tightening lug bolts in the old days.
Thanks Glen, new I could count on you for the right info. Every time I try to get the links, my tablet shows it downloaded but then I can find it. Tablet is smarter than me lol.
Thanks Unfriend, I've been seeing a lot of posting about seafoam, but have never used it. I've thought about adding it to my oil and gas, just don't know that much about it.

I'll post some pics when I get it opened up. For education purposes to new folks if nothing else.
I think this project may be like remodel work, you never know what you'll find until you tear into it.

Thanks again to all
Hutch
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

k hutchins
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 279
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:48 pm
Zip Code: 48843
Tractors Owned: 1948 Farmall Cub
193 plow
1948 snow/grading blade
Woods 59 C3
Cub 144 cultivator
Cub 22 mower
Cub 172 one row planter
Original manuals for all the above

Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Sat Nov 04, 2017 2:31 pm

Well if it weren't for bad luck, I'd have none. Twisted the head off bolt #1. The one that's dead center in the head. The rest came out fairly easy. I've gotten the he freed up but the shaft of that bolt is frozen in the head. I can twist/rock the head about an 1/8" at the corners. I believe the threads are free, it's the shaft that's bound tight.
I drilled out about 1 1/4" (that's as far as my smallest bit would reach) applied heat and liquid wrench. Still frozen. I filled the hole with liquid wrench, hoping it will swap down over night and break free tomorrow.
Any and all suggestions accepted and appreciated at this point :help: :lost:
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:

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Don McCombs
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Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby Don McCombs » Sat Nov 04, 2017 2:39 pm

Patience is your friend. Let the penetrant work.
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k hutchins
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 279
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:48 pm
Zip Code: 48843
Tractors Owned: 1948 Farmall Cub
193 plow
1948 snow/grading blade
Woods 59 C3
Cub 144 cultivator
Cub 22 mower
Cub 172 one row planter
Original manuals for all the above

Re: Oil in anti freeze 1948 cub

Postby k hutchins » Sat Nov 04, 2017 4:17 pm

Thanks Don
Not my strong suit but I'll try. That's why I had to walk away from it today. Too frustrated and panicked.
I am glad I took everyone's advice and got new head bolts though. Now I'll need them.
Why is there never enough time to do the job right, but always enough time to do it over. :?:


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