Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Farmall Cub Forum -- Questions and answers to all of your Cub related issues.

Moderator: Team Cub

Forum rules
Notice: For sale and wanted posts are not allowed in this forum. Please use our free classifieds or one of our site sponsors for your tractor and parts needs.
User avatar
Rick Prentice
Team Cub Guide
Team Cub Guide
Posts: 5532
Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2004 7:24 am
Zip Code: 43528
Tractors Owned: 47(circle cub),48(Floyd backhoe),49,,51,54 and another 55
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: OH, Holland

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Rick Prentice » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:33 am

Shane. Did you call TM? The seal they show sure looks like a rubber coated seal blowing it up on my big screen, Image

Rick
When I told my dad I've been misplacing things and doing stupid stuff----His reply---"It only gets better"

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:35 am

Rick, I haven’t called them. I will Monday when I get back to work. Thanks!
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

User avatar
Peter Person
Cub Pro
Cub Pro
Posts: 3783
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2005 4:27 pm
Zip Code: 06076
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: CT, Stafford Springs

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Peter Person » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:33 pm

Shane Nelson wrote:
Peter Person wrote:Shane,
The A.T.I.S. site references a CR 29887 in addition to the National 355526.
CR 29887 is still available;
https://www.kartek.com/parts/chicago-rawhide-cr-29887-usa-single-lip-seal-3-inside-diameter-3-78-outside-diameter-716-thick.html

SKF-29887:
https://www.amazon.com/SKF-29887-Small-CRWH1-Diameter/dp/B00CLIQCG0

SKF-29887 is steel cased as well.


...but it has a coating on the outer rim;

SKF CR29887 Single Lip Nitrile Rotary Shaft Seal 3x3.876x0.43
Description Technical Reviews [0]
SKF CRWH1 Nitrile Oil Seals: These radial shaft seals have Waveseal lip design to reduce friction and heat generation. The seals have a double steel shell to simplify installation and provide a tight fit in the housing bore. The outside diameter of the seals is coated with Bore-Tite, a non-hardening, water-based polyacrylate sealant, which enables the seals to accommodate small imperfections in the housing bore. This seal also has a carbon steel garter spring. These seals are primarily designed for lubricant retention.
Benefits: Reduced friction and heat generation, provides a tight fit in the housing bore, accommodates small imperfections in the housing bore
Brand / Quality: SKF - High Quality
Inside Diameter: 76.20mm = 3 inch
Outside Diameter: 98.45mm = 3.876 inch
Width: 11.13mm = 0.438 inch
1957 Farmall Cub "Emory", Fast-Hitch, L-F194 Plow & Colter, L-38 Disc Harrow, Cub-54A Blade, Cub-22 Sickle Bar Mower, IH 100 Blade

Image

Circle of Safety

Landreo
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 1172
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 7:10 am
Zip Code: 29130
Tractors Owned: fcub(5)
tricycle cub
154 (4)
Earthmaster (2)
JD 40T, JD 420 crawler-loader, JD MT
JD Unstyled A, Styled A, Unstyled AR
JD H
Centaur Tractor
AC Model C, G
Cub Cadets (9)
Gibson D
Red-E
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: SC, Ridgeway

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Landreo » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:34 pm

The seal from TM looks like a steel cased seal.

Most or all modern steel cased seals have bore-tite or another brand of coating. It is the orange or green paint like coating on the edge of the seal. It is not rubber and appears to be only around 1 mil thick.

The original seal for the R2 retainer is no longer available in the sense that the National seal company is out of business and are now part of another company, Federal Mogul?, but seals that can replace the National seal are still being made just not by National or FM. The National seal was a rubber cased seal, 3" shaft and 3.875 bore, single lipped. I would have to measure my old seal but I believe it was either .4 or .5 thickness.

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Sat Mar 03, 2018 10:48 pm

Landreo, most of these seals this size seem to be .4375” wide. I may have went a little far going four places but that’s the machinist coming out of me.
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 7:33 am

I sent Ron an email at TM Tractor, he said the seal they sell is rubber cased. One of the pictures on their website sure looks steel cased to me, the one where you can read "National".
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

User avatar
Stanton
Team Cub
Team Cub
Posts: 5610
Joined: Mon Jun 22, 2009 6:56 am
Zip Code: 64070
Tractors Owned: 1942 Farmall AV, serial #87025
1947 Farmall Circle Cub, serial #2116
1948 Farmall Cub, serial #46066
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Lone Jack, MO

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Stanton » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:12 am

A very interesting thread, Shane. Keep up the good work. :coffee:
Stanton
Image Circle of Safety

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:25 am

It's in the milling machine, had to use the old 2 axis mill, the 3 axis is tied up on a money paying job :lol:
Attachments
IMG_4650.jpg
IMG_4651.jpg
IMG_4652.jpg
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

coppersmythe
5+ Years
5+ Years
Posts: 1255
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2009 9:19 am
Zip Code: 70785
Tractors Owned: '48 trimmed dash high crop cub , '78 3/4 cub , lo-boy/59 mower , '64 "galvanized" cub , cub-6 toolbar , sicklebar mowers , 54 blade , plow , mott mower , early belly mower . '57 higgins v-drive wooden boat/original graymarine 4 banger . international 1010 pickup with 345ci v-8 .
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: louisiana

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby coppersmythe » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:29 am

:Dito: Stanton , my sentiments exactly . i have read many of Shanes other posts/work . to have access to that kind of shop and the ability to use that equipment is a blessing . and an employer savvy enough to give you pretty much cart blanche . Niiiiice , coppersmythe .......................PS: self-employment did have sort of a down side ,I had thousands of bosses over the years , all different personalities . my clients .

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:37 am

Clearance hole in center done. Will bore the seal bore in the lathe so it’s perfectly round.
Attachments
CD391893-BCAF-4F81-A408-1EF9B7748835.jpeg
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:39 am

Roughing outside.
Attachments
A5F5989B-844C-4770-B048-E72C19913B45.jpeg
EAC7B14E-457F-4A2C-BB83-441A35E14A38.jpeg
3FCFF7A9-AFFF-4028-A48F-F33AFE82B6A3.jpeg
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:02 am

1st prototype milled, now to split tractor and make sure clearance isn’t an issue and bore seal bore.

Oh and clean up my mess.
Attachments
3E1CF8FA-E268-42B0-BE3C-E78E82B99DCB.jpeg
E01EB698-4794-4735-9B00-BB1AAB6BD035.jpeg
C22D870E-1538-4648-AD9A-B70564346653.jpeg
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

Matt Kirsch
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 4670
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2004 3:04 pm
Zip Code: 14559
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Matt Kirsch » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:10 am

You're going with an original seal, right?

It was my understanding that the seal itself is not the problem, but the material the seal retainer is/was made from.

User avatar
Shane N.
501 Club
501 Club
Posts: 3963
Joined: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:24 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: .
1970 International 140 (Norman)
1972 International 140 (Keeferdoodle)
1949 John Deere A
1993 Ford 4630 W/Loader
1965 John Deere 110
1961 Cub Cadet Original

Sold Cubs..
1947 Cub #1447 (Arnold)
1949 Cub (Walt)
1950 Cub (piece of junk)
1952 Cub
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: N.C.

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby Shane N. » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:43 am

I do want to use an original seal. Here's a picture from Messicks of part #364692R91 which is what Case/IH calls for the Cub rear main seal. It looks original rubber cased to me. Here's also a photo from TM Tractor of the seal they offer, it doesn't look rubber cased to me when compared to the one from Messick's. Maybe they used a different photo from what they sell. Has anyone ordered a rear main seal from TM?

I just ordered one from Messick's and returned the one I bought at O'Reilly's last week with an O.D. of 3.751"
Attachments
364692r91.jpg
c4280s.jpg
Every home is a school, what are you teaching?

Circle of Safety

JoeB
10+ Years
10+ Years
Posts: 213
Joined: Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:37 pm
Zip Code: 35650
eBay ID: retrocrop
Tractors Owned: '47 Circle Cub
'55 International 100
'55+'56 100 Hi-Clears
'71 140
Acres of Red Tractors.
Twitter ID: @RetroRowCrop
Location: Moulton, Alabama (NW AL)

Re: Crankshaft Seal Retainer~~Prototype~~

Postby JoeB » Tue Mar 06, 2018 12:32 pm

Here is a new aftermarket Victor Reinz ( Mahle ) Double lipped seal on the right, and an original seal with the ih logo on the left. New seal is double lipped.
Attachments
DSC05462 (Medium).JPG


  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “Farmall Cub”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: chuck ma and 5 guests