Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:25 am
Greetings and many thanks to the Buckeye Cub Tuggers, from the strange guy,
with the strange family and the strange dog. We apologize for dashing off before
the dance, but the kids were getting a little antsy, and after absorbing some
inspiration from the tug, I wanted to get home and take a crack at firing up
our latest foray into insanity - what turns out to be a 1948 Cub, which I've now
owned for 2 weeks (more on that shortly).
Since introductions seem to be in order, we're the Ray family - William & Joan,
with kids Sage and Will, and either the world's most boring dog, or most
interesting footstool, Pokey. For the record, Pokey's an AKC Pembroke Corgi,
but we think that his previous owner just didn't finish payments on his legs.
Professionally, I'm a - get this - Professor of Pediatrics - at The Ohio State University
Medical School department of Pediatrics/Nationwide Children's Hospital in Columbus
Ohio. I don't believe it either... Still, they pay me to develop new bleeding-edge
technological/computational approaches to biological problems, and to teach
bio/med students how to do it, so what the heck - it's a fun gig while it lasts.
More functionally, I'm a raised-in-the-country computer geek - grew up in Ohio's
2nd largest school district, with the state's 2nd lowest population. My family
wasn't a farming family - my father's an engineer (roll-design, for US Steel, retired),
and my mother's an elementary school teacher - so I never learned "farming"
per se, but I'm a heck of a lot more country than city.
Joan's a research system administrator specializing in computational-biology
software and hardware support - which mostly means that she keeps my machines
purring for me, or tries to, when there's time between the myriad of other
system administration tasks around the Research Institute at Nationwide Children's.
She's a New-Orlean's born city-girl, and never imagined living anywhere other than
a city-center apartment before we met. Unlike the normal direction such stories
go, she's eagerly adapted to life with a guy who thinks that scrounging old iron
from an abandoned factory is the epitome of a fun evening out. She does own
probably 20 pairs of shoes - but they're just about all hiking and work boots that
she bought on close-out, so I guess that's OK. To keep up with my expenditures
on tools, etc, she does her part collecting high-end electronics, AV equipment,
and DVDs. I bought her a vacuum cleaner for St. Valentine's day this year - a
5HP vacuum cleaner. No, not one of those "5 Sears HP" vacuums - a real, 5HP,
powered by a 220V 3-phase motor that draws 45 starting amps, and 18 running
amps @220V/3P. She thinks it's cool... God, I love that woman...
We've got a house in Columbus OH, where we've been stuck for many more years
than we care to think about, and about 5 years ago we bought a small farm on the
southern border of Hocking County (just North of New Plymouth OH), that we're
slowly trying to rehabilitate from 100 years of neglect, and the rather bizarre
"improvement" notions implemented by its previous owner.
Since we're cheap, and my upbringing has me convinced that A) ancient iron that
still works, is likely to keep working for far longer than modern iron, and
B) I'm reasonably likely to be able to make an arbitrary chunk of ancient iron work,
we're trying to do this rehabilitation with relatively inexpensive old tractors and
whatever other bits of equipment we can keep running. Our workhorse tractor is
a neglected, leaky, Massy Ferguson 65, with the Continental gas engine. Probably
could use the mains and rod bearings replaced sometime soon, but for now, it
chugs away running the loader, brush-hog, etc, without complaint. For where the
Massey can't safely get on our hilly property, we've got a bizarre Italian vineyard
tractor - a CAST. It's a low, wide, articulated 4wd crawler, with independent
4-wheel suspension (dual A arm suspension - just like a sports car :-). If the
tuggers aren't offended, I might try to bring it to the Tug next year - I'd rather
like to know what it can really do - unfortunately something just went awry with
the transmission, but I'm hoping it's an easy fix, because now I need it to go get my
pickup back out of the ravine (took some friends on a quick tour of the farm this
afternoon, and found a spot a the bottom of one of our ravines that previously
did not have a 4' deep hole in it. The poor old Ford can usually get itself out of
most jams that it gets into, but with the front frame sitting on the ground, it's
a bit out of its league). For little stuff, we've a passel of Gravelys - I think
there's a "red paint" theme going on here somewhere...
Which brings us to the Cub. SN 14689, if Sage wrote the numbers down
correctly. Bought it from a fellow that I got to know as the factory he was
working at got closed down and gutted. One day while forklifting an old
bandsaw out of the wood shop for me (hey, it's a 36" throat bandsaw - it
needed a forklift), he mentioned that he had a cub he was interested in
selling. I figured that with his impending unemployment, he needed the
money more than I did, and hey, I can always use another tractor. Didn't
know diddly about cubs, other than the name. Always kind of thought of
them as overgrown lawnmowers. Cub Tug handily disabused me of this
notion, but I still can't say I know much about them...
So, we finally picked it up (first time we'd seen it) 2 weekends ago. Wasn't
running, so it was a winch-on, push off affair with the trailer, and we didn't
have time to try to start it that weekend. Last weekend, I had wrist surgery
for carpal tunnel, so I wasn't in the mood for wrenching. Finally this
weekend, after watching the Tug, we chased some wiring around, decided
that it looked like a 12V conversion, and tried to get it to start.
Nothing. Ok, yeah, yeah, connections, connections, connections. Yank
the starter loop a little harder, and now it's turning. So far so good.
The connections can wait.
Still doesn't start. Doesn't even cough. Doesn't even hiccough.
Mildly bizarre, but maybe it's not getting fuel - who knows how long the PO had
it, or whether it was even ever working for him. Pull the intake hose
off the carb, and feed it some ether.
Still doesn't start. not a pop, not a peep.
More bizarre. Maybe I bypassed looking at the connections too soon.
Let's see about spark. Well, with the plugs out, we've got fire.
There's a little pointy doodad on the front of the block, and lookit
that, a notch it points at in the crank pulley. Pull the valve cover off,
(so who thought that burying that behind the hydraulic lines like that
was a _good_ idea?), find TDC, yup, the pointy doodad points at the
notch on the pulley. "Snap" - huh - it's got a coil, _and_ the remains
of a magneto - never seen that before. Still, it goes snap, and we
get a spark, just as we round TDC, so it doesn't look like a timing
Pull the wire from the coil off the distributor and dangle it by the
block - snap - spark - at least a good 5/8ths inch. So it's probably not
that the spark is too weak.
Pull the carb, and feed the intake manifold ether directly, while
Nothing. Zero, zilch, zip, nada.
Grumble, grumble grumble... Something is worse wrong here than
I'd hoped. Spin it with the plugs out. Ruuuh, ruuh, ruuuhruuhruuuh...
Noisy starter, alarmingly slow for spinning an engine with no
plugs in, but more alarmingly, no "chuff, chuff" from the plug
holes. The !@#$% thing has got zero compression, on at least two
cylinders. So, I guess I now have another project... Have a BMW
diesel engine sitting in the shop already waiting for me to find the
time and room to work on it, a couple Gravelys that need help, and
now the CAST with it's weird knock in the transmission, and here comes
another project. Still, it's cute, and it looks like I can probably strip
it in an afternoon, so it'll probably float to the top.
Had it for 2 weeks, it doesn't work and appears to need a whole-engine
teardown, just to get it to speak to me, and what am I doing? Now
I'm trying to buy a 2nd one...
Time for bed, crazy science stuff waits in the morning.
I'll try to get some pictures posted sometime in the not too distant future - probably
after next weekend, practically though.
Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:47 am
Welcome!! You Will have fun with your Cub. BTW, sounds like you have a stuck valve (or several). You can remove the carb
and the valve access cover from the side of the engine and spray down the offending valve stems with a penetrating soln.(read
Kroil, PB Blaster or Sea Foam--NOT WD40). Or, (you can see the valves thru the spark plug holes) direct some spray in that
area, eliminating the need to remove above mentioned parts. You can also GENTLY tap on the valve heads VIA the spark plug
holes to see if they are even willing to move (I had some luck with that ). AND I'm sure other much more experienced forum
members will chime in with additional information (or correct mine
Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:15 am
Welcome to the forum and thanks for coming to the Tug. It looked like you and your family had a good time. I'm sorry I didn't get the chance to come up and personally introduce myself. Also, thanks for the great introduction here. I'm sure you'll get more help than you need with your Cub project - and probably a few of your other ones as well - from the guys on the board. Good luck, and again, welcome.
Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:05 am
Welcome to the forum!!
It sounds like Bill E Bob has you going on the right path. Don't tear into the engine just yet... take some time and do the investigative work first! Take the valve cover off and observe the valves as someone spins the engine for you...
Great introduction...good read!
Mike in La Crosse, WI
Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:49 am
Bill E Bob wrote:
sounds like you have a stuck valve (or several). You can remove the carb
and the valve access cover from the side of the engine and spray down the
offending valve stems with a penetrating soln.(read Kroil, PB Blaster or
Sea Foam--NOT WD40). Or, (you can see the valves thru the spark plug
holes) direct some spray in that area, eliminating the need to remove above
mentioned parts. You can also GENTLY tap on the valve heads VIA the
spark plug holes to see if they are even willing to move (I had some luck
with that ).
I had the valve cover off when I was making sure I really knew that I was
at TDC. If valves aren't closing, they're stopping just proud of closed - definitely
not frozen wide open, as they're following the lifters as they should.
Embarrassingly short of proper tools this weekend, as Pokey the wonder
footstool, in his sole act of contraryness, peed all over my traveling toolkit
a couple months ago, and I haven't remembered to pull the kit back out
of the parts washer in the Columbus shop - so I didn't have a feeler gauge
handy. But the Mk I. calibrated eyeball says that the intake lash was about
25 thou, and the exhaust was a shade under 10, on cylinder 1. I didn't look
closely at the others, as 1 not right, was enough to work on at the moment.
Still, it could be moving but stopping short of seated. If the nominal cold
adjusted lash is supposed to be 15 thou, and there's (at least) 5 thou of
retrusion on the exhaust, 25 thou lash on the intake could mean it's stopping
15 thou or more short of the intake seat. Definitely worth looking at.
If anyone else has any words of wisdom, I'll happily stockpile them and
try to get to checking them all this coming weekend. We spend our weeks
in Columbus, and our weekends at the farm, but next wekend we're at
least partly in Michigan, scrounging some metal roofing so I don't know how
much time we'll have to devote to the Cub.
Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:49 am
Will, welcome to the forum. I'm sorry I didn't get a chance to meet you face to face at the Tug. The next time you're in the area give us a yell. If you need a hand with the cub there are several of us fairly close to lend assistance if you'd like the help.
Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:38 am
Welcome!!! Great introduction!
Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:00 pm
Bigdog wrote:Will, welcome to the forum. I'm sorry I didn't get a chance to meet you face to face at the Tug. The next time you're in the area give us a yell. If you need a hand with the cub there are several of us fairly close to lend assistance if you'd like the help.
Something you could use for the 'Tug is either a big sign that floats over your head
that says "Grand Poobah", or some sort of "Important Players" list, so that random
clueless newbies who wander in off the street, know who we ought to be introducing
ourselves to and thanking for the generous hospitality. Of course, the number
of nitwits who buy cubs sight-unseen and wander into the 'Tug 2 weeks later
looking for a clue about what they've bought, is probably minimal, so the utility
of that suggestion might be limited...
I'm sure I'll end up needing some help with this adventure, but I'm not quite in
over my head yet, and I prefer to see what I can do to screw it up royally, before
calling in the experts
If I would have known about the Tug 2 weeks ago, I
would have just dragged the Cub from its previous owner's house straight to the
Tug to get some advice. Following my typical train of luck, I actually moved itfurther
from you, when I took it home to the farm. Its former home was
Buena Vista, just over the hill to your East.
Hopefully by next year, I'll be able to bring a Cub and contribute, rather than
just wander around trying to glean a clue.
Thanks again for the event, the hospitality, and the information!
Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:56 pm
Hello again all,
Figured I ought to complete the introduction of the Cub before moving
over to other forums.
Last week we left our valiant little Cub gasping for air, or rather, not
bothering to gasp for air, for lack of anything resembling compression
on at least 1 & 4. 2 didn't feel particularly enthusiastic, and I couldn't get
a thumb onto 3 well enough to be sure about it.
This weekend I had the time to say "Off with her Hood!", and start to open
up the engine. "Valves not closing" would be a good summary. Gigantic
chunks o' crap, floating around in the cylinders, would be a good summary
too. Glad I decided to just go ahead and pull the head rather than playing
with it any more!
Random minor observations:
Looks like it's got .20 over pistons, but no observable cylinder ridge - not even
a carbon one. The pistons were pretty filthy though, so they've clearly been
run. Need to find my gauges and see how far out of round we are.
The bolster is bulged and cracked, but the radiator still appears to be sound.
Crappy brazing job, backed up with JB Weld. I'm torn between just fixing
the brazing and putting it back together (since it clearly had held a full
cooling system for at least 2 years since it had been parked), and slotting the
top so that I can push the bulge back out and flatten it properly.
Several of the valves had rather significant chunks of rust scale caught between
the face and the seat, and I'm not sure if the seat has been damaged as a result.
I'm going to have to pull them to be sure, but I didn't have my valve spring
compressor or valve seat cutter with me, so that'll have to wait until this weekend.
No other breaks/repairs that I've found so far, so I'm not thinking this should
be too bad.
The current state of the world, in pictures, if you care to browse:http://mother.killernuts.org/g2/v/Misc/SGF/EquipmentArchives/Our+1st+Farmall+Cub/DSCI0002.jpg.html
Fri Aug 01, 2008 5:59 am
Will - it looks like you have a nice project on your hands. May I suggest that you start a thread in the main forum where folks can follow your progress?
Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:57 am
Good morning. Enjoyed the second chapter of your introduction and I am looking forward to more of the same as you post in the main forum, your progress on fixing this little beastie. I am really enjoying the form of your posts, almost as if we were sitting around the wood stove in an old general store sitting in them rockin chairs. I really enjoyed that. Those are the kind of posts that bring back a lot of old,and I mean old memories...
Thank you very much, and is sure sounds like you are having fun. Please do take pics as you progress with your repairs, alterations and maintenance. This is going to be an interesting project for you and an interesting read for us
Glad you are part of our family now