Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Farmall Super A, AV, 100, 130, & 140 1939 - 1973

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Lt.Mike
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Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:35 am

As I posted earlier I picked up a ‘53 SA that had an IH auxiliary hydraulic control valve installed but it’s missing parts to make it work.
I was able to get a reprint of the factory manual for this but it shows only an exploded view of the parts. I would like to see it mounted on a tractor to see exactly how it mounts.
I’m trying to chase down the linkage parts and handle. I’ve found them for a Super C which is straight but the A has a bend.
I have to assume it’s bent for a reason and one that differs from the C.
I have searched for a photo of a SA with this part installed but no luck. Anyone here have one or a pic of one installed. I need to know better of what I’m looking for.
I’m going to reach out to a fellow I know that has some 30+ A and SA tractors to see what he may have and be willing to part with.
Gonna have to break out the King James because I’m bound to be quizzed while I’m there. :)
Here is a pic of what I have...
The main hydraulics work well, front and back but I’d like to use this valve because it’s a factory piece and to hook to the grader blade to power angle it for snow duty. The SA is higher than my Lo-Boy and I don’t think I want to keep jumping on and off to angle it by hand.

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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Slim140 » Mon Oct 21, 2019 8:59 am

Here's a picture of everything but the handle, looks like part of yours is broke off. Should be able to fix it though.
https://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/v ... p?t=585931
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Lt.Mike
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Mon Oct 21, 2019 11:15 am

Thanks!
The handle is somewhat a mystery. I have a knob on the right side of the steering post opposite of the throttle. I don’t know if it mounts to the top, or side. I don’t know if I can get away with one from a Super C. If it mounts the same but the connecting rod is a different length I can shorten or lengthen it as needed. First choice is to find the exact parts made for the SA.
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Jim Becker » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:23 pm

We've been down this path before. This isn't the greatest picture, but you can see where it mounted and why the lever is curved.
viewtopic.php?t=75122

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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:10 pm

Jim Becker wrote:We've been down this path before. This isn't the greatest picture, but you can see where it mounted and why the lever is curved.
http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=75122

That’s what I needed Jim thanks.
It would seem mine still has part of the mount.
Rudi’s post reflected that image was part of the TC-39B parts catalog he had on the server and I have to assume it was one of the files lost.
That post was 7 years ago so I guess like locust it’ll have to be brought up again in 2026. ;)
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Ol Timey Farming LLC » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:35 pm

Lt.Mike wrote:
Jim Becker wrote:We've been down this path before. This isn't the greatest picture, but you can see where it mounted and why the lever is curved.
viewtopic.php?t=75122

That’s what I needed Jim thanks.
It would seem mine still has part of the mount.
Rudi’s post reflected that image was part of the TC-39B parts catalog he had on the server and I have to assume it was one of the files lost.
That post was 7 years ago so I guess like locust it’ll have to be brought up again in 2026. ;)



Here is the page I think you need from Rudi,
http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.cleancomputes.com/Cub/Super%20A%20-%20Super%20AV/TC-39B%20Parts%20Catalog/Page%20242.jpgImage
and the whole TC-39B parts manual is here
http://farmallcub.com/rudi_cub/www.cleancomputes.com/Cub/Super%20A%20-%20Super%20AV/TC-39B%20Parts%20Catalog/index.html

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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:37 pm

The exploded view above has value in that it shows the individual parts but is vague on how it’s mounted. An actual photo would be the best. The illustration Jim pulled up from a 2012 post is pretty close to that. The link you’ve provided must have replaced what was originally lost though it doesn’t have the image from the 2012 post.
With information and photos limited on this option it makes it that much more attractive to find and make work.
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Jim Becker » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:01 pm

Note the hex-head cap screw (with no nut) listed under reference number 1. It is what holds the lever in place. The reason no nut is listed is because you reuse the existing nut on the bolt that is currently in the same hole. That bolt is holding the governor control quadrant. The new bolt holds both the quadrant and the remote lever.

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Location: Farmingdale NJ

Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:35 pm

Jim Becker wrote:Note the hex-head cap screw (with no nut) listed under reference number 1. It is what holds the lever in place. The reason no nut is listed is because you reuse the existing nut on the bolt that is currently in the same hole. That bolt is holding the governor control quadrant. The new bolt holds both the quadrant and the remote lever.

That bolt is about an 1-1/4” longer as the PO, or one of them upon removing the lever shimmed it with a polyurethane shock bushing. I wasn’t 100% sure it was where and how the lever was mounted until I saw the illustration you found.
The lever itself is pretty basic so I suppose I could fabricate a lever until I’m able to find an original.
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Super A » Wed Oct 23, 2019 10:48 am

Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al
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Lt.Mike
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Wed Oct 23, 2019 12:05 pm

Super A wrote:Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al

Those you can find and yes they “look” like they could be the same. Im 99% sure the remote valve itself is the same. A Super A is a 113 engine while the Super C is a 123 engine. Here’s another question for the puzzle, are these two engines externally the same with the only difference being more cubic inches for the Super C?
I’ve found auxiliary setups for the C and am trying to see if if it can be used on the SA with minor tweaking.
Quote by Gary Pickeral I like
"If it can cast a shadow, it can be restored"

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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Slim140 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 12:12 pm

Super A wrote:Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al

Just looked it up on Messicks, the lines and the body are the exact same part number on the Super C and the Super A.
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Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Don McCombs » Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:08 pm

Lt.Mike wrote:
Super A wrote:Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al

Those you can find and yes they “look” like they could be the same. Im 99% sure the remote valve itself is the same. A Super A is a 113 engine while the Super C is a 123 engine. Here’s another question for the puzzle, are these two engines externally the same with the only difference being more cubic inches for the Super C?
I’ve found auxiliary setups for the C and am trying to see if if it can be used on the SA with minor tweaking.

I believe that the later SA’s were also 123’s.
Don McCombs
MD, Deep Creek Lake

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Lt.Mike
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Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:38 am
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1 - ‘48 (5641) Allis Chalmers G
Location: Farmingdale NJ

Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:28 pm

Shane N. wrote:
Super A wrote:Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al

Just looked it up on Messicks, the lines and the body are the exact same part number on the Super C and the Super A.

I just checked the operators manual for the hydraulic remote control valve against a really good image posted on eBay of a Super C lever.
The Super A part number is 356 804 R1
The number on the Super C lever is 356830 R3
The attachment points from the levers to the rods are different with the Super C having it about 1-1/2” above the pivot point and the Super A’s about 1-2” below the pivot point.
The lever screw pn is 181 351 screw, cap, 5/16 NF x 3” hex-hd. And the washer 21/64 I.D. X 3/4 O.D.
The remote itself is ...
356 788 R91 Valve, auxiliary remote control, assembly.
Though I initially thought revision I believe the “R91” is an example of IH using General Motors “R” numbering system adopted after WW2.
If my Farmall A & SA horder friend up north doesn’t have the parts or doesn’t want to part with them I’ll be haunting eBay for a long while.
Mike
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Lt.Mike
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Posts: 2356
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:38 am
Zip Code: 07727
Tractors Owned: 1 -'58 International Cub Lo-Boy
2 - '46 International A's
2 - '52 Farmall Cubs
1 - '53 Farmall Super A
1 - ‘41 Ford 9N with a ‘49 8N Engine
1 - ‘48 (5641) Allis Chalmers G
Location: Farmingdale NJ

Re: Super A auxiliary hydraulic control

Postby Lt.Mike » Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:52 pm

Don McCombs wrote:
Lt.Mike wrote:
Super A wrote:Kind of a dumb/lazy question but is the valve and hyd. line from the pump the same as a Super C with FH?

Al

Those you can find and yes they “look” like they could be the same. Im 99% sure the remote valve itself is the same. A Super A is a 113 engine while the Super C is a 123 engine. Here’s another question for the puzzle, are these two engines externally the same with the only difference being more cubic inches for the Super C?
I’ve found auxiliary setups for the C and am trying to see if if it can be used on the SA with minor tweaking.

I believe that the later SA’s were also 123’s.

Just went through Guy Fay’s letter series tractors. That may have happened in ‘54 and it’s said at least 500 Farmall C’s in their final production were made with the 123 engines.
The bore of 3” x stroke of 4” = 113.1ci
The 123 engine had a slight increase in bore,
3-18” x 4” = 122.7ci
Compression for both was the same at 6:1.
The super c got wider automotive style rings though and the main bearings are said to have been changed to something similar to what was used in a Diesel engine.
Those are the only differences noted.
(Got a little sidetracked I know :roll:)
Mike
Quote by Gary Pickeral I like
"If it can cast a shadow, it can be restored"


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