SA left final drive, do they break often?

Farmall Super A, AV, 1939 - 1954

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SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Gerry Powell » Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:31 pm

When I was refurbishing my SA, I noticed the inside of the left final drive had been repaired with nickel welding in the area just above the inside bearing cap. I also found the left final drive didn't have any oil in the pan and the left side was all cruddy with caked oil. I drove the tractor some and noticed a small oil leak on the inside of the left final but couldn't locate it. After I put my 3pt on the tractor (the SA never used a 3pt before I put one on it) and used it for mowing and disc-ing, I finally found the leak just above the inside bearing cap at the repair. The weld had broken, I probably helped it along by hanging the disc on a fence post when making a sharp turn. That got my heart rate up, when it hung up the governor kicked in and the front tires went about 3 feet up int the air before I was able to get the clutch in.
So I ordered a take-off left final from JP tractor and after cleaning it up some, found it had been repaired with nickel rod on the inside lower two bolt holes that mount it to the tractor. This repair was just above where my original final had been repaired. JP had not noticed the repair when they shipped it to me because of the oil and grease, and they quickly made good and shipped me a replacement take-off at no cost to me.
In the meantime, I noticed that Steiner Tractor sells an aftermarket left final for the SA, but not the right. This leads me to believe the SA left final commonly breaks since I have already seen two and there is an aftermarket for the left but not the right.
Anyway, since I'm using a 3pt on my SA which stresses the finals beyond what they were designed for, I went ahead and ordered an aftermarket drive since they're make of malleable iron instead of cast and are supposed to be stronger.
If anyone needs an original left final for their SA, I'll have an extra 9811 if anyone wants it for what I paid, $125 plus shipping.
Has anyone else seen this problem with the SA left final?
Gerry
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby CubitisNH » Thu Jun 10, 2010 7:54 pm

I've seen plenty of them welded up--must have been a weak area. Have also noticed the left side is the only one offered aftermarket.
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Super A » Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:17 am

Must be something to it. After all, a lot of the chassis weight is on that side. That is why when I look at a Super A or an A, one thing I do is try to rock the rear wheel in the housing. Most will have some slop. When I was having my tractor restored, we discovered a repair in the area around the top-most bolt hole. The cool thing is that it had been done very neatly--a little bit of grease/mud buildup hid it completely, and now that it's painted, I would have to point it out to you for you to see it---I can't emphasize enough what a good job they did. I asked my dad about it but he couldn't remember anything happening, but he reminded me that at one time it did all kinds of jobs, from field work to dragging logs, so "anything was possible."

According to some of the info I have seen, the Super A-1 used Super AV finals, because apparently they were stronger.

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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Gerry Powell » Thu Jun 17, 2010 10:18 pm

I got my left final drive housing from Steiner and got it cleaned up and painted ready to install. I checked it over pretty good, chased all the tapped holes and wire-wheeled all the bearing and oil seal areas. Overall, I'd give it a "B" grade, the casting is a little rougher than the original parts, but I thought looks aren't most important, looks like it should work. The oil weep hole area just below the brake band is done a little differently than the old 9811 part, the 9811 had some re-enforcing ribs alongside the hole for added support that the new part doesn't have, but the area just above the hole is beefed up some, so maybe it's a wash. I got the oil seal in no problem, one of the new bearings was about .002 bigger than the old so I had to do some sanding on the cast to get it to fit.
Well, I finally got all the seals, bearings, gears and axles installed, so far so good. The I tried to put it on the tractor and it wouldn't go for some unknown reason. All the stud holes lined up, the two pins line up, should fit. After many hours of taking it off, checking everything, putting it back, still wouldn't fit and I finally discover why. The brake band pin hole in the Steiner part didn't line up with the hole in the tractor. I looked at my old 9811 housing, sure enough, the Steiner housing has the hole moved a little, about 1/4". When you try to put it together, the pin is misaligned enough so that it keeps the parts from going together.
Steiner says this part is designed to replace the 9824DC and the Farmall TC-39C parts catalog says the housing is "9824DCX (will work for 9811DCX)". So you would think it would, my tractor used the 9811DCX. I guess somewhere along the line, the 9824 was introduced. But I wouldn't think Farmall would move the location of the brake pin in the newer part, especially since the manual says the new part will replace the older part. They just didn't make mistakes like that in their manuals. It didn't say "9824DCX (will work for 9811DCX if you replace the transmission case)"
So my question is, does the 9824 really have the brake pin hole located differently, or is the Steiner part made wrong?
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Jim Becker » Fri Jun 18, 2010 11:50 am

I've never worked on a Super AV and it has been a long time since I did anything with a Super A. So this is based mostly on a look in a few manuals. It may not be correct. I think 9811DCX was the original used on a Super A and 9824DCX on the Super AV. From what I can tell, the difference is that the upper implement mount holes were tapped with studs on 9824DCX with smooth through holes in that location on 9811DCX. 9824DCX could be used as a replacement for the other by using different hardware at that location. The pin holes for the brakes should be in the same location.
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Gerry Powell » Fri Jun 18, 2010 6:34 pm

I talked with Mr. Steiner this morning about the housing and he offered to refund my money, which I accepted. The pin hole for the brake is definitely drilled in the wrong place. All the rest of the housing is correct, it's bad luck that one hole was drilled wrong.
The only thing that could be done would be to fill the hole and re-drill and that is an expensive proposition since I'd have to take it apart again, pay for machine work, and then put it all back together. The other option would be to make a brake pin that compensates for the misalignment.
I've got two 9811s, both have tapped holes at all implement locations and the 9824 replacement from Steiner is tapped at all locations.
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby josys36 » Mon Jun 21, 2010 1:53 pm

It is interesting that this topic came up. I dropped my Woods L59 mower this weekend so that I could check the fluid in the final drives. The bracket for the mower covers the plug, and also covers the casting plate. Imagine my surprise when the left final was cast in 1958 and the tractor is a 1950! LOL. Looks like someone along the lines replaced the left final drive. So I was thinking is this a replacement part just for the Super A, or was this final the cast for let's say the 140? In any event it is in perfect shape. Just found the timing ironic!

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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby FarmerJ » Wed Jun 23, 2010 7:22 am

I have some drops from a 140 that have a different brake style,Fortunately I kept the brake bands and should swap out ok to my SAV.The difference is 140 increase's leverage for easier braking.
I have several other drops
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Re: SA left final drive, do they break often?

Postby Bus Driver » Sat Jun 26, 2010 4:33 pm

Very interesting discussion. Thanks for posting it here.
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