super a front wheels adjustment

Farmall Super A, AV, 100, 130, & 140 1939 - 1973

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Komatsuna
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super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Komatsuna » Mon Jan 19, 2015 8:51 am

I did a bit of searching through the forum prior to posting this. Attempting to adjust the front wheels tread, they are pretty rusted up. I have removed the bolts and pins from the axle extension clamps, and the tie rod clamps. I did not think that it was just going to slide out, but I am gathering info for the best way of going about moving the axles.
Is it possible that it is so rusted up it wont move? I do have tenacity, perseverance, determination and time. Won't need it until Early May.

Will a torch be helpful, and if so; what am I attempting to do with the torch. I dont want to be willy-nilly, torching things.

If I go the route of giving it dead blows, and advice for where would be a good place to strike w/o causing damage.

as always thank you.

staninlowerAL
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby staninlowerAL » Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:27 am

I have had some success positioning the front end between two sturdy anchoring points like trees or posts, having enough room to work between them. Jack up one side and firmly secure the other side of the axle to one anchor point. Use a come-a-long or some other wenching tool to pull on the axle that is elevated, pulling in a straight line between the two anchoring points. Once you have tension on the axle, you can hammer on the outside of the axle tube and use some heat if it is needed. Maintain constant pressure, pulling on the axle with the tool. Once you get it to move a bit, it should slide from the tube. Clean up all the parts and reassemble, then repeat for the opposite side. It's time consuming but usually successful. NOTE: There was a post a few weeks ago about using a large round brush or "flapper" sanding tool on a drill to clean the inside of the tube. You can probably search for it. Good Luck, Stan
EDIT: It is not necessary to pound on the tube, the object is to vibrate the metal to break the rust bond. Same with the heat, even application to expand the tube, not hot enough to deform or destroy any metal.

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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Super A » Mon Jan 19, 2015 2:37 pm

On the ones I have messed with, it seemed like the heat did the most good on the bottom half of the axle tube (as if it was on the tractor).

Al
White Demo Super A Restoration Updates

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Komatsuna
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Komatsuna » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:14 am

thank you stan and super a.

I was trying to come up with some type of situation where I had some mechanical advantage. Ive got a good spot to set up a come-a-long type operation, and hopefully with some heat and some time I'll get it to move.

thank you folks.

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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Matt Kirsch » Wed Jan 21, 2015 12:53 pm

You need a large oxy-acetylene torch with a rosebud tip to apply large amounts of high heat very quickly. If you're expecting to use a little propane clicky-torch for this job, you're going to be disappointed.

The tube will absorb and dissipate the heat very quickly so the large torch is necessary to keep ahead of it. Really, this is one of those situations where nothing else will do. The contact area is so large that there is no way any of the magic penetration sprays could ever hope to get in there.

Last year I did a Cub axle. One side was free, the other was stuck. I actually bent an 18" pipe wrench trying to twist the stuck side free, and eventually succeeded by applying heat with my oxy-acetylene torches, while trying to twist the axle with the pipe wrench and a 6' cheater bar.

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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby staninlowerAL » Wed Jan 21, 2015 2:27 pm

Matt Kirsch wrote:You need a large oxy-acetylene torch with a rosebud tip to apply large amounts of high heat very quickly. If you're expecting to use a little propane clicky-torch for this job, you're going to be disappointed.

:Dito: I should have mentioned that as well. The constant pressure with pulling will give you the mechanical advantage. If you anchor one side of the axle and pull on the other side, the chance of breaking something like the bolster, etc should be minimal. Good Luck, Post how it comes out. Stan

Komatsuna
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Tractors Owned: '54 AC G
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Location: South Eastern Pennsylvania

Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Komatsuna » Thu Jan 22, 2015 10:46 am

Thank you.

Can I move the axle extension without moving the tie rod extension? Or do they move simultaneously?

You mentioned using a pipe wrench to turn it loose, did you have the tie rods disconnected to do that or will they still rotate with out the tie rods being disconnected?

Oh man! Thank you all.

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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby John *.?-!.* cub owner » Thu Jan 22, 2015 12:15 pm

The tie rods have to be extended separately. The clamp bolts have to be removed (in notches in the inner rod).
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Matt Kirsch » Thu Jan 22, 2015 1:34 pm

For a front end the size of the Super A you will need a LARGE pipe wrench and a long cheater pipe, IF you can get enough heat into it.

I don't think my Cub's front was very badly stuck. One side slid easily.

Komatsuna
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:00 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: '54 AC G
'80 hydro 84
'80 AC 6080
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Location: South Eastern Pennsylvania

Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Komatsuna » Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:05 pm

so after about 5 hours, Using two trees and a come-along, I got the front left axle moved and greased back up, got it moving pretty nicely ( Ill work out the other side tomorrow. The manual says to do both axles first then do the tie rods, but I started on the left tie rod prior to moving the right axle.

I couldn't seem to get the tie rod to budge even a millimeter. I am having a difficult time getting the wheels not to turn, and could use some advice as to how to stop the wheels from steering left and right.

Any advice for those tie rods? Can I Take off the control arm? Would that make it any easier. I am a little stuck.

Matt I appreciate what you are saying about the pipe wrench, but I cannot visualize where I put it and what I am trying to do with it. I have plenty of long cheater bars, 10 footers if I need it, that's not problem.

Thanks again for everyone's help on this.

staninlowerAL
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Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby staninlowerAL » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:18 pm

This worked for me: Completely remove the tie rod from the tractor and remove all clamps, bolts, etc and lay the tie rod assembly on a large flat heavy piece of metal like a H beam or heavy channel. It needs to be large enough for the tie rod to have about 8 inch x 12 inch support area. Rotate the tie rod and hammer on the outside tube working from one end to the other, but try to not deform the metal. Try to work some lubricant like PB into the tube. After working the entire length of the tube with the hammer, place one end of the tie rod in a vice and try to rotate the other end while striking it with a hammer or suitable tool. The hammer action should break the rust bond between the tube and rod. You might have to use some heat but sparingly, the tube portion is not very thick. If this does not work, try placing in a freezer overnight then place in a vice and heat the outer tube while trying to turn the tube with something like a pipe wrench. A little heat on the tube will expand it before the solid rod warms up and should come apart.
I think the intent of the cheater pipe is to extend the leverage of the pipe wrench if you try to rotate the axle inside the pipe housing.
Stan

staninlowerAL
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Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby staninlowerAL » Fri Jan 23, 2015 11:04 am

There was a couple of posts on the farmallcub forum about cleaning the axle tube and seperating the tie rod parts. The link below to my post with the question will take you there. The two links are referred to in my post so read all the way to the end to find them. I believe the information will help solve your problem. Stan
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=87067
EDIT: I found that these two topics are already locked in the "HOW TO" section under STEERING, WHEELS/WEIGHTS. Good to know that the information is saved. Thanks, MODS.
Last edited by staninlowerAL on Fri Jan 23, 2015 5:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Matt Kirsch
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Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Matt Kirsch » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:38 pm

When I did my Cub, I put the pipe wrench on the exposed axle extension and attempted to twist the axle inside the tube to loosen it up.

After applying enough heat, the axle extension began to turn a little. I just kept rotating it until it spun easily, and then worked it back and forth while pulling by hand to finally remove it.

The tractor looks quite strange with the "knee" pointing upward and the hub above the axle tube.

I removed the tie rod and the wheel and tire from the tractor before attempting to slide the axle. In this case the wheel turning is irrelevant.

Komatsuna
Posts: 19
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2014 6:00 am
Zip Code: 00000
Tractors Owned: '54 AC G
'80 hydro 84
'80 AC 6080
'48 Super A
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Location: South Eastern Pennsylvania

Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby Komatsuna » Sat Jan 24, 2015 2:06 pm

We did it. We got the tie rods free. Heat and pressure. Just need to clean and put everything back together. I read the article about cleaning the the insides of the rods. Next up; back wheels.

Thank you everyone for the help.

Devin

staninlowerAL
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Posts: 2769
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:34 pm
Zip Code: 36558
Tractors Owned: Cubs: (3)'49's, (1)'52, (1)'57 IH Cub LoBoy w/FH, (1)'72 154 Number Series Loboy, '76 Longstripe w/FH, Mowers: C-22, Bush Hog 412, Pennington 59, Woods RM42CF, Woods 42, assorted FCub plows, planters, discs, etc. OTHERS: '49 AC B & Ind. Sickle mower, '61 AC D12 Ser 2, '52 8N, '56 Ferguson 35 Deluxe, '53 MM BG (offset), (2) '49 Avery V's, '56 JD 420C, with Blade and fire plow, '85 JD 850 (Yanmar) w/72" belly mower, '76 Yanmar 1500, Sears Surburban's, MTD's, Jeeps & other misc. "treasures"
Circle of Safety: Y
Location: AL (Southwest)

Re: super a front wheels adjustment

Postby staninlowerAL » Sat Jan 24, 2015 3:47 pm

Komatsuna wrote:We did it....Devin

Success is a good feeling!! :D


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