Cheap fertilizer?

Thu Jan 29, 2009 5:00 pm

Where's a good place to get a good price on fertilizer? I would like to grow about a 1/4 acre of corn
and so far, I've seen 50lb bags of 12-12-12 going for about $16 each. Is that a good price or not?
Thanks.

Curt

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Thu Jan 29, 2009 6:44 pm

one word -manure

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Thu Jan 29, 2009 7:37 pm

Don't know if $16- is a good price for a 50 lb bag. That is about 1/2 of last spring's price.

Gotta agree with Daddydip. Manure. Contact several farmers in your area. Turkey manure in this area of Missouri, pickup load, free to very cheap if you load it yourself. Cow manure when I lived in Iowa, same deal.

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Thu Jan 29, 2009 8:53 pm

Last we bought was $8. but that was a couple years ago!---havent checked this years price!---last year We didnt fert. anything, just planted, kept it cultivated and weed free! thanks; sonny

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Thu Jan 29, 2009 10:02 pm

NoSnooz wrote:Where's a good place to get a good price on fertilizer? I would like to grow about a 1/4 acre of corn
and so far, I've seen 50lb bags of 12-12-12 going for about $16 each. Is that a good price or not?
Thanks.

Curt

You will need to apply a higher rate of Nitrogen. Removal rates are roughly 1 lb N, .4 lb phosphate, and .3 lb potash per bushell of grain. You could blend in some 29- 4-4 or whatever you have available. The best time to buy is in the fall, the big box stores discount fertilizer so as not to carry it through the winter.

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Fri Jan 30, 2009 9:37 pm

NoSnooz wrote:Where's a good place to get a good price on fertilizer? I would like to grow about a 1/4 acre of corn
and so far, I've seen 50lb bags of 12-12-12 going for about $16 each. Is that a good price or not?
Thanks.

Curt



Fertilizer has been sky-high for some time now, though last I heard it had come down a little. I have a feeling $16 a bag is going to be pretty close.

Manure has a lot of benefits but it takes a LOT to get the same effect from a chemical fertilizer out of a bag. And not applied properly, manure can be too "hot."

You can use 12-12-12 at planting and then go back with nitrogen, like ammonium nitrate (34-0-0) later--say when the corn is between a foot and two feet tall. I wouldn't try to put a season't worth of nitrogen to my corn at planting.

Al

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:13 am

i would prefer manure over any manufactured fertilizer available, for me the bottom line is uptake of the nutrients,minerals and vitamins. the numbered fertilizers are great for building nice plants ,look good and all but they don't have the trace minerals to make what goes on my plate nourishing. i prefer bovine manure over horse manure and of course never use a hot manure around any plant :) so i guess there has to be a happy medium.10-10-10 for side dress but i plant in manure. :arrow: :idea:

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:30 am

daddydip wrote:i would prefer manure over any manufactured fertilizer available, for me the bottom line is uptake of the nutrients,minerals and vitamins. the numbered fertilizers are great for building nice plants ,look good and all but they don't have the trace minerals to make what goes on my plate nourishing. i prefer bovine manure over horse manure and of course never use a hot manure around any plant :) so i guess there has to be a happy medium.10-10-10 for side dress but i plant in manure. :arrow: :idea:


There are three lessons here:

1. Manure is good, for organic matter ie "soil building." It is a good fertilizer used properly. If I could easily get hold of some rotted stable manure I would probably put it on my garden. A lot of people think fertilizer in a bag is "bad" or "not as good" as manure, compost, etc. The plant can't tell, nor does it care, if the Nitrogen, Phosphorous, or Potassium came from a bag, or from a steaming pile of cow pooh. In short, nitrogen is nitrogen, doesn't matter where it came from. Plus, it takes so much more to get the same amount of nutrients as a 50 lb. bag. In production agriculture, you apply chem. fertilizers in pounds per acre. You apply turkey litter for example in tons per acre. Some say manure is better for the environment. Apply it wrong, and it's as bad or worse than any "chemical fertilizer."

2. As far as trace elements goes, you probably don't need them, they are probably adequate in your soil already. (see lesson 3)

3. Do a soil test. That's the only way to be sure what your garden soil needs. Most states offer basic fertility, & pH soil tests for free. (pH is important, if you're too acid or alkaline, the plants can't uptake the nutrients properly no matter how much you apply.) Go to the extension office, get the materials, follow the directions, and know for sure.

Not trying to argue, but there are a lot of misconceptions about fertilizer in a bag. Of course, if it keeps going up we may all have to resort to manure!!

Al

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 10:44 am

I put manure on my garden every time I get the opportunity to get some, but there are a couple things to consider. Manure from the farm will have a lot of weed and grass seed in it that wasn't digested. No problem between the rows, since the tiller or cultivator will take care of them. In the rows though, they are a problem. Most bagged manure has been sterilized to kill the seeds left in it. A way around this is to spread it in a shallow pile and keep tilling it as the weeds sprout for a summer, then apply when the garden is plowed in the fall or spring.

Second thing about manure is that it takes several seasons to fully break down for the plants to be able to use it all. this is good that it is long term, but bad in that you do not get the nutrients right away.

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 2:34 pm

1. Manure is good, for organic matter ie "soil building." It is a good fertilizer used properly. If I could easily get hold of some rotted stable manure I would probably put it on my garden. A lot of people think fertilizer in a bag is "bad" or "not as good" as manure, compost, etc. The plant can't tell, nor does it care, if the Nitrogen, Phosphorous, or Potassium came from a bag, or from a steaming pile of cow pooh. In short, nitrogen is nitrogen, doesn't matter where it came from. Plus, it takes so much more to get the same amount of nutrients as a 50 lb. bag. In production agriculture, you apply chem. fertilizers in pounds per acre. You apply turkey litter for example in tons per acre. Some say manure is better for the environment. Apply it wrong, and it's as bad or worse than any "chemical fertilizer."

good point and even better discussion, i have been looking but can't remember which book i read it in but, as far back as the 40's there have been govt. reports reporting that if you think that you will get your nutrition from the soil, it wasn't going to happen, basically because most of our soil has been depleted of all minerals and vitamins. i agree that a plant doesn't care about
where the npk comes from.that is to build the plant structure. i again agree that in "production" agriculture chemicals are applied,but at what cost? we have a nation of stuffed undernourished obese people because we have been bushwacked into excepting the guide lines of the bottom line. farmers came out with chelation therapy for the cows because of the same situation,and also the fact that they didn't want to waste there money on something that a cow wasn't going to have good uptake from. green leafy plants like spinache ,collards and what not benefit greatly from nitrogen but that isn't going to give it the trace minerals we need to not have to take a hand full of pills everyday for our bodies to function properly and to have optimum health. especially as we grow older. don't take me wrong in this post,as i'm only talking about what i prefer as to the way i garden. i'm working on my compost pile and trying to take a crap soil that was put there after some road work by the local govt.and make it viable, i also have a worm bin for casing and expect to use the waste water from growing fish(tilapia) on the garden as well. i guess what it comes down to is that now a day quick resolve is acceptable. but if things are going to get any better we should look forward with a keen eye on the past.
i agree also that if we don't become better steward's as to how we apply this stuff to the land ones no better then the other. :wink:

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 2:59 pm

daddydip wrote:1. Manure is good, for organic matter ie "soil building." It is a good fertilizer used properly. If I could easily get hold of some rotted stable manure I would probably put it on my garden. A lot of people think fertilizer in a bag is "bad" or "not as good" as manure, compost, etc. The plant can't tell, nor does it care, if the Nitrogen, Phosphorous, or Potassium came from a bag, or from a steaming pile of cow pooh. In short, nitrogen is nitrogen, doesn't matter where it came from. Plus, it takes so much more to get the same amount of nutrients as a 50 lb. bag. In production agriculture, you apply chem. fertilizers in pounds per acre. You apply turkey litter for example in tons per acre. Some say manure is better for the environment. Apply it wrong, and it's as bad or worse than any "chemical fertilizer."

good point and even better discussion, i have been looking but can't remember which book i read it in but, as far back as the 40's there have been govt. reports reporting that if you think that you will get your nutrition from the soil, it wasn't going to happen, basically because most of our soil has been depleted of all minerals and vitamins. i agree that a plant doesn't care about
where the npk comes from.that is to build the plant structure. i again agree that in "production" agriculture chemicals are applied,but at what cost? we have a nation of stuffed undernourished obese people because we have been bushwacked into excepting the guide lines of the bottom line. farmers came out with chelation therapy for the cows because of the same situation,and also the fact that they didn't want to waste there money on something that a cow wasn't going to have good uptake from. green leafy plants like spinache ,collards and what not benefit greatly from nitrogen but that isn't going to give it the trace minerals we need to not have to take a hand full of pills everyday for our bodies to function properly and to have optimum health. especially as we grow older. don't take me wrong in this post,as i'm only talking about what i prefer as to the way i garden. i'm working on my compost pile and trying to take a crap soil that was put there after some road work by the local govt.and make it viable, i also have a worm bin for casing and expect to use the waste water from growing fish(tilapia) on the garden as well. i guess what it comes down to is that now a day quick resolve is acceptable. but if things are going to get any better we should look forward with a keen eye on the past.
i agree also that if we don't become better steward's as to how we apply this stuff to the land ones no better then the other. :wink:


I agree with you, the more "natural" I can be in the garden, the better I like it. I'm really more afraid of the antibiotics, etc. in a lot of commercial animal feed than I am what is being sprayed on fruits and vegetables. So many of the pesticides on the market now are designed to work more with nature than against it. The thing we have to be careful of is rejection of technology because it doesn't seem "natural."

That said, I am a big proponent of "organic," "humanely raised," "all natural," etc. food. I think if a person wants to buy eggs from chickens living outside, or fruit and veggies that haven't be sprayed, it should be easy to do so. Plus, growing stuff using these practices can help the farmer make a little better income.

I would have to do some research but I don't think using one fertilizer or the other affects how nutritious the veggies are. From what I can remember from my veg. production class, if they are healthy, they should have the nutrients. If they are weak and undernourished, no so much.

Al

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 5:04 pm

yup super a that puts us on the same page. a lotta folks don't give it enough thought. there is a difference between a fresh egg and a fresh fertile egg. we have to push back against some of the accepted thinking. question the answers. :!: :arrow: :?:

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 5:41 pm

daddydip wrote:yup super a that puts us on the same page. a lotta folks don't give it enough thought. there is a difference between a fresh egg and a fresh fertile egg. we have to push back against some of the accepted thinking. question the answers. :!: :arrow: :?:



Speaking of eggs, my co agri. teacher at school is teaching an animal science class this semester. Mostly sophomores, with some juniors and seniors. Many are interested in careers in vet. medicine or the human health field. He had several this week that honestly did not know that eggs come from chickens.

That is what we are dealing with as a society. Understanding where the food comes from is critical. Too easy for misinformation to spread if people don't understand at least the basics. Reminds me of alar on apples back in the late 80's (or 90's?). Lots more hype than facts.

Al

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:00 pm

There are lots of dairies in our vicinity, so we use manure as fertilizer. A big dairy about 5 miles from here will give you all the fresh from the cow manure you want for free, or for $14 a ton if it has been composted and turned 4 times. This composted stuff is nicer than anything I've ever seen come out of a bag. We'll drive over there with the pickup and trailer and get several loads per season. Such a deal!

Ed

Re: Cheap fertilizer?

Sun Feb 01, 2009 8:14 pm

Curt , $16 a 50 lb bag is $640.00 a ton Last year I bought 10-10-10 early in the year for $420 a ton later in the year it was $600 a ton . So that is a good price right now for fertilizer.
Put down about 100 lbs of the 12-12-12 when you plant. come back with about 100 lbs of 30-0-0 or something close to it when the corn is about 10 inches tall. then another 100 lbs of 30-0-0 when it is 2 ft tall or so with a little luck with rain you will have a good crop of corn
I put a little fertilizer down every time i cultivate , but I like to play with the cub . Three applications will be fine.
David