Katrina (HELL)

[Joker555]

New Orleans is most likely going to recover.
It is bringing out the best and the worst in people.
We,here in HOUMA,are ok,the victoms are starting to come into the surrounding areas.
Hopefully they are not looters

[Rudi]

Glad to hear that you are ok.

There were questions as to how you made out, and folks was waiting to hear from you.

With luck, things will get better shortly.

Was watching the toob today and our Navy is ready to roll to help with the clean up, they are just awaiting sailing orders from our Prime Minister after Mr. Bush says Come on Over

Peace, may the Lord Bless you and yours and give to His children what each requires according to HIS will

[Bigdog]

Joker - we are indeed thankful to hear that you are OK. I hope our other board members fared as well.

[beaconlight]

God bless you and yours. glad you made it ok. Some times peace has to be kept by Smith and Western. A shame but none the less at times that is the only way.

Bill

[Patbretagne]

Never seen rescuers going out with automatics at the ready, people are already scared nearly to death, life is being lost as the minutes chug by.
5, 6 days after the order to go in and "Help" is given???
Thanks for reminding us of the strongest richest country looks after it's own people in times of trouble. Bodies floating past in the street.
Politicians afraid that their image may be harmed feel that two visits won't be enough!!!
Sorrowfully for the victims and you Pat
PS Joker, hope it all goes ok.
PPSWill they really rebuild in a basin again inviting the same to happen again? Is that a good idea, is it not putting ourselves up against nature saying we are stronger than you?
Excuse me if I sound bitter.

[Eugene]

Pat:

I read several foreign and US newspapers daily. The perception in the press is that nothing was done in a timely fashion to send emergency assistance into the effected area. The news focus has been primarily on New Orleans. The effected/devastated area is a land mass as large as Great Britian. As of yesterday there were still communities that had not been contacted by emergency services personnel.

A couple of thing bother me about the press - they are out to make a good story. You see the TV news personalities in clean clothes interviewing healty ablebodied people in their homes who can't get out, no food or water for days. My though is if the TV people can get in, then with a bit of initiative these people can get out ((walk)), instead of waiting for a government emergency service to rescue them.

Just to let you know how big the US is. The Missouri National Guard was dispatched to Mississippi. It's a two day drive to get personnel and equipment into the effected area.

No drinking water. There is a bottle of bleach under the sink in almost every house in America. A gallon of bleach will disinfect thousands of gallons of water.

I have been through several floods where transportation was cut off for days. This was a rural area where you took care of your family and the local community. You didn't wait for the government to get things done.

Oh! There is a bias in the US media. Stories about all of the timely actions taken don't make the front page. Foul ups do.

Comments and opinions from a dumb old country boy.

Eugene

[beaconlight]

How right you are Eugene.

Bill

[Kodiak]

Joker555, It's good to hear from you and know your ok. I'm sure the forum would like to hear from others if they get a chance to do a brief post. There are a lots of other more pressing items to deal with I'm sure. Just to let you know you and your family are in our prayers and let us know if we can be of assistance.

Ron W.

Eugene, You are very much on target. Thanks

[lonniebug57]

Eugene, to guote a Chrysler ad, "I couldn't have said it better myself'. Concerning the media,wasn't the information we received from them after the storm hit that New Orleans was spared , that the storm had missed the city and that they had "dodged the bullet? Now they are calling for a congressional investigation into what they perceive to have been a slow response. Shouldn't the media have to held accountable for putting out false and misleading information? But we should all understand by now that the "story" is more important than the truth.

[phantom]

i listened to the mayors evactuation order. i am sure that is the first time i have heard a "mandatory" order given with two other options...leave town, come on down to the big dome, or carry an ax so you will be able to chop thru the roof when the water gets too high. {too high in this case being approaching sea level} able bodied people were lining up for the hurricane party a day before the shelters opened and brought only a boom box with them. where is self responsibility.

the saddest day in my lifetime as a u. s. citizen the day we went from "ask not what your country can do for you" to the "great society"

[Harold R]

For accurate info on the Katrina recovery........go here.
http://ensec.typepad.com/stormwatcher/

Never seen rescuers going out with automatics at the ready, people are already scared nearly to death, life is being lost as the minutes chug by.
5, 6 days after the order to go in and "Help" is given???
Thanks for reminding us of the strongest richest country looks after it's own people in times of trouble.

Marshall Law. Military carries automatic weapons. No reports of the military having to fire them. Local police have fired....to stop the looting.
The storm created such a logistic nightmare that first line aid, which was there, couldn't be dispatched due to the vanished infrastructure. A quick shift to airlifts, but the airfield were out of service. Each day brings improvements. I feel pretty sure the best was done, dispite what the media and the politicians say.
Yes the city will rebuild....in the basin........as has Holland......several times.
In times of trouble, not only do we take care of our own.......we take care of others too.....anywhere it's needed. As a country....we got hit in the chin pretty hard. Our knees may have wobbled a bit, but whose wouldn't? Rest assured......we've regained our footing.
Click on the posted link and see!!

[Rudi]

Guys:

I guess I will pop in me dos centavos as well. I like threads such as this primarily because it not only teaches but can remind us about topics such as civics, humanitarianism and accord. Please excuse my ramblins, but this truly is interesting.

Em and I have been watching this unfurl from a couple days before the hurricane hit. We watch CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, CBC, CTV, ASN, ATV, BBC - yeah, at times we can be news junkies.

Em and I have both remarked on how similar this event is to 911 and to other major catastrophies around the world. The Ice Storm in Eastern Canada comes to mind as does the major blackout in the US and Canada last year.

Should New Orleans rebuild - you betcha It is the heart of the south. As New Brunswick is the Heart of Acadie, so is New Orleans the Heart of the Cajun South.... La Belle Temps en roulez I hope that is right, my French still is pathetic....

A couple points to ponder:

1. As a citizen, we all have responsibilities to our God, our Families, ourselves, our communities, our neighbours and our Nation. Part of that responsibility is to take proper precautions in bad weather situations and to be able to evacuate your family in a timely and responsible manner, when such conditions arise. This is only common sense. To disregard warnings and evacuation orders is tantamount to reckless endangerment never mind the s word....

2. As a citizen, we all have responsibilities to contribute to our Community, our Neighbourhood and to our Nation.

3. As a citizen, we all have responsibilites to be ready, able and WILLING to be a citizen.

Citizenship is not just a right nor is it just a privilege. It is one of the most sacrosanct aspects of a just society and a moral guideline. Citizenship is a responsibility, it is a state which must be earned and earned on a daily basis. It is about giving, it is about helping and when in need to be mature enough to recieve the gift graciously.

Citizenship is not and never will be a licence to take willy nilly from our Government, Our Community nor our Neighbours.

What gladdens my heart is the selfless giving that is being shown by many people in the affected areas as well as those who have come from far away such as the FDNY and other departments to help. What bodes well is the fact that there are so many good people who wish to only help as best they can.

Unfortunately, there are those in our societies who do not have the resources to deal with situations such as this. These are the ones who truly pay the price of a natural disaster. The poor, the sick, the marginalized do not have the health, the means or sometimes even the warning to be able to evacuate. These are the ones who NEED our help the most. As in all times and places, it is the responsibility of each citizen to do the utmost they can to aid their brothers and sisters who cannot help themselves.

As understanding as I try to be at times, there is no excuse in my mind for some of the stuff that has been happening.

1. Looters are CRIMINALS - period, and should be treated as such.

2. Criminals who prey on the weak, the weary, the defenceless at a time such as this are not citizens. They have no right to claim the benefits of citizenship. They are scum, lowest possible rung on the human step ladder. It is about time that the Poliitcally Correct and the Intelligentsia realize this and make the changes to a system that gives criminals more rights than victims. Criminals are just that, criminals! And they should be treated as such, without concern for their well-being, without concern for their rights as they have abrogated those rights. They should be arrested, tossed in the hoose gow and in this situation until it is fixed, forgotten about. Feed them the minimum that is required, house them so that they do not get ill or mistreated... but forget about their rights - they have none.

3. Politicians like Nancy Pelosi and her current statements about President Bush not only are counterproductive, they are downright inflammatory, and dangerous invective which fills no useful purpose but instead creates disharmony and distrust at a time when solidarity of a people is needed. If she was to offer concrete solutions instead of political posturing and sniping, then it might be of some use, however, drivel such as that does no good at all except to highlight how small and childish these type truly are. Also, the House Leader Tom DeLay really needs to rethink his stance as well -- an investigation is not a good idea, it is a necessity. They have to fix what is not working right, that is the only way to learn and to progress as well as to ensure that this will not happen again. We cannot prevent so-called Acts of God (although, I am not sure why it is described as such?), but we can mitigate their results..

A good politician would stand up, support the government and VOTE to increase the presence and the aid flowing. Support not discord is what is needed.

As for Monday Morning Quarterbacks, hey everybody is a bloody expert from the safety and security of their favourite arm chair. If however, they were faced with the decisions the President has to make, they probably would not do as well.

As much as I disagree with many of his policies, the man is doing his job the best way that he knows how. Not only is he the President of the US, he also has responsibilities on a global scale. This is unprecidented and must be kept in persepective expecially considering the theatres in which he must operate.

Have there been mistakes ? YES
Have there been errors in judgement? YES
Have there been gaps in pre-disaster planning? - YES

Should Mike Brown's head be offered up as a sacrifice? No, it is not the fault of one man. Is the system busted ? I am not sure, I am not qualified to answer.

All I know is that when man is gracious to man, then good stuff follows.

It was with pride that I noted my Prime Minister Paul Martin, called President Bush and offered ANY and ALL resources that Canada could provide that our friends, family and neighbours can use. Yesterday morning we sent 3 Navy vessels and a Coast Guard Cutter to help and assist Louisiana, Alabama and Mississippi as best we can. We are ready willing and able to help as is required.

Friends and family do that.

As for passing the blame - there will be time enough for that, and all the MMQ's and other Armchair Experts I am sure will more than gladly provide their 2 cents worth... and that is exactly what it is worth - 2 cents.

Now, for the media -- well we all know where most of us stand on this.... there really needs to be a major mindshift in the focus of modern day journalism -- stop with sensationalism and start with accuracy......

Thanks for allowing me my daily dose of the

[Eugene]

I spend a short stint as a jailer - very short. The prisoners in the county jail have an exercise room, cable TV, air conditioning, catered meals - and I mean quality meals, laundry service, free medical care, a small library and no work.

There are a number of elderly and working poor in the area who would be much better off in jail. And that's not right.

There is going to be a number of positive things coming out of this disaster. Missouri and a number of other states are reviewing disaster plans. The response for the next big one will be much better executed.


Eugene

[Carm]

Rudi, If'n I had a laptop I would have take that long post to the bathroom to read And I must say.....well put!

[Patbretagne]

1. Looters are CRIMINALS - period, and should be treated as such.

2. Criminals who prey on the weak, the weary, the defenceless at a time such as this are not citizens. They have no right to claim the benefits of citizenship. They are scum, lowest possible rung on the human step ladder. It is about time that the Poliitcally Correct and the Intelligentsia realize this and make the changes to a system that gives criminals more rights than victims. Criminals are just that, criminals! And they should be treated as such, without concern for their well-being, without concern for their rights as they have abrogated those rights. They should be arrested, tossed in the hoose gow and in this situation until it is fixed, forgotten about. Feed them the minimum that is required, house them so that they do not get ill or mistreated... but forget about their rights - they have none.

Oh Dear!
I seem to have put my finger in an ant's nest and stirred it up,

Agreement, journalists do seem to try to "Make" the news rather than report it.

Bleach, now that's a very good idea and one that we should all consider. We don't keep bleach because we have a Septic Tank and the smallest amount down the loo/sink etc kills all bacteria in the tank and it doesn't work purifying our natural wastes. I'll buy a bottle next time at the store.

Yes self help is primordial, Noelle and I try to rely as little on others and have emergency rations at the ready.

Yes I realise the US is big and that you are at present dealing with a landmass the size of the United Kingdom, half the size of France.

The majority of your post Rudi I am totally in agreement although some of the names we don't get to hear or know over here, especially as news input daily is about 30 minutes in this household.
However the bit about criminals and their rights quoted above seems a bit strong.

Is there a grading to "criminality"?
At what stage in criminality does one loose one's right to be a citizen?
A kid who takes a Mars bar in the local sweet shop? Should he loose his citizenship as he is legally a criminal.
Murder, certainly a criminal, but human rights and citizen?
Someone who shoots another to protect himself or his property, here in Europe he is normally a criminal, even though a potential victim, a citizen? A mother who has no food for her kids, taking what she can to feed them in time of national distress, a criminal legally yes, citizen?

I am at present dealing with a case of a young 25 year old Drug Dealer who has handled 40kg of Maruajna, has served 9 months preventative, has waited 2 years while the justice closes the case and he comes up in early October for trial, he has settled down, has a settled relationship with a lovely young lady, I rather forced him to do a years training in joinery, he now has a full time job is part of the local football team. He has stopped all contact with the Weed and has started to appreciate a good glass of wine with us when we see and entertain him or he works with me. At present He is making himself a lovely oak dining table for his home. Above all though he will be judged a Criminal, will that suddenly change him into a Non-Citizen, trash to be junked and minimally fed and forgotten about being harassed in prison?

Humanity comes into criminality as well, the criminal is still the neighbour that our Lord speaks about in the Bible. Eye for Eye Tooth for Tooth is Old Testament, the New Testament brought us Love instead. I think that is Unconditional Love.

Me and you must watch out that we are not caught accidentally taking a Mars bar or even a washer off the counter at Case IH, we could be, to quote "A criminal.....They are scum, lowest possible rung on the human step ladder"

Hope that with my european outlook and feelings I don't offend you, I will now look at something less thought provoking, the Farmall Cub board!
Pat