Difference between M & super M?

Farmall M, Super M, 400, 450 & 560 Tractors, 1939-1963

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Difference between M & super M?

Postby BigBill » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:17 pm

Whats the difference between a farmall M & super M besides HP? Is there any visual differences that i can look for the decals are gone and i'm not sure what it is. Is there any bad quirks to look for besides leaks.
I'm technically misunderstood at times i guess its been this way my whole life so why should it change now.
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Postby Trent M » Tue Sep 11, 2007 10:23 pm

Of course, like you said, more HP. Look for the SN tag if it is still there. I don't know off the top of my head what the SN differences were. Also, I believe there were Stage 1 and Stage 2 Super M's, I think they had to do with live PTO and live hydraulics, but someone else will need to confirm that. Hope this helps. If it has TA (torque amplification or hi/lo) it is a Super M-TA. Looking to go big, are we? 8)
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Postby Festus » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:09 am

I may be wrong (I almost was once before!) but I think there are serial number similarities between the M and Super M. The Super should have the Letters S M as the model number unless it is a Louisville Super M and then it would say L S M after the model. I hope I am not misleading you! As for physical differences, there really do not have to be any depending on the model year. As far as something to watch for, I really like to keep the steering on a tricycle M good and tight because they can absolutely break your arm if they fall into a small hole. The looser the steering, the worse it seems to be!

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Postby Denny Clayton » Wed Sep 12, 2007 6:07 pm

The Super M SN plate on a non-Louisville SM would read: SM F501. That is the first one and it goes up from there.
A Louisville tractor would start with, and read: SM L500001.
http://www.ytmag.com/cgi-bin/snlookup.c ... MTA+and+MV

Some past discussions might shed some light on your questions:
http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewto ... highlight=

http://www.farmallcub.com/phpBB2/viewto ... highlight=
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Postby Super A » Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:20 pm

The Super M was geared a little different, seems like the biggest difference was in 4th IIRC. They were a little faster to handle the extra HP.

The other threads Denny posted sum it up pretty well.

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Postby BigBill » Thu Sep 13, 2007 8:30 am

It has hydraulics with a manure bucket on the front. In the rain pasing by the engine looks weird too it had a 6 or 8 bolt thing on the left side near the hood sticking out. I think its gas but i'm not sure. Is it worth $1,200 if she is a runner?

Now comes the hard part to buy the "M"($1,200) or i'm so close $$ wise to my first farmall cub($1,650)? Dam i want them all and sooner or later i'm going to get them all anyway. I have a lot of heavy work to be done and the bigger tractor can do it...
I'm technically misunderstood at times i guess its been this way my whole life so why should it change now.
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Postby Bigdog » Thu Sep 13, 2007 10:02 am

Bill - the M is a very handy tractor and will do tons of work. I grew up with a couple of them on the farm and for many years they were the "big" tractor. The price is reasonable if it is a good runner.
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Postby Festus » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:42 pm

Bill,

If you have the use for the M and it seems to run out well, the price is good. They can do a ton of work and can be adapted with 3 point hitches, power steering, wide front, etc. as budget and desire dictate. I have used mine to pull a 10 foot disk , a 4-14 plow, a 7 foot grader blade etc... I don't have a loader on mine, it is on the Super H , but if you can swing it, power steering is very handy with the loader. I saw in the past where someone adapted an old Chevy steering box and pump onto an M, but it has been so long ago, my memory fades as to the specifics. Even with these upgrades, compare what you would have in it compared to a new 50 horse tractor!!!

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Postby Trent M » Thu Sep 13, 2007 12:58 pm

That price sounds right reasonable to me. If it were my decision, I'd probably decide which is the better "deal." The M with the loader, assuming it runs good and everything works and is at least decent sheetmetal-wise, 1200 is good. If its a Super M, you better jump right on it!! Now if the Cub is a real good one with implements, then it might be a better deal at $1650. My $0.02.
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Postby Mach-z » Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:40 pm

The "BIG" differance that is very easy to see is the change over to disc brakes from band brakes . The Super "M" has a stronger transmission [ stronger bull gears and axles], 10 hp more 264 cubic inch.
The brakes are a dead give away , there is no debating on the differance.

I have a 52 Super M , NEVER MIND THE STAGE 1 O 2 titles that means nothing. It is just a marketing deal .
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Postby LiL' Red » Mon Sep 24, 2007 6:13 am

Mach-z wrote:The "BIG" differance that is very easy to see is the change over to disc brakes from band brakes . The Super "M" has a stronger transmission [ stronger bull gears and axles], 10 hp more 264 cubic inch.
The brakes are a dead give away , there is no debating on the differance.

I have a 52 Super M , NEVER MIND THE STAGE 1 O 2 titles that means nothing. It is just a marketing deal .

Does your 52 have live PTO?
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Postby parts man » Mon Sep 24, 2007 9:53 pm

Mach-z wrote:The brakes are a dead give away , there is no debating on the differance.



There was a disk brake option availlable for the pre-super M's. :wink:
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Postby Mach-z » Wed Sep 26, 2007 9:06 pm

parts man wrote:
Mach-z wrote:The brakes are a dead give away , there is no debating on the differance.



There was a disk brake option availlable for the pre-super M's. :wink:[/quo

How do you put disc brakes on a M when the casting is differnt for mounting them on a Super M ?

Live PTO not sure what you mean by that . I push in the clutch and pull the lever and we have PTO . It's not the latter style that had its own clutch . This PTO works off the main clutch , i can slip a bad clutch on a tractor by throwing alot of load at it on the dyno .
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Postby Super A » Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:54 am

Mach-z wrote:
Mach-z wrote:

There was a disk brake option availlable for the pre-super M's. :wink:[/quo

How do you put disc brakes on a M when the casting is differnt for mounting them on a Super M ?

Live PTO not sure what you mean by that . I push in the clutch and pull the lever and we have PTO . It's not the latter style that had its own clutch . This PTO works off the main clutch , i can slip a bad clutch on a tractor by throwing alot of load at it on the dyno .


The very last straight M's had IH disk brakes. I have personally seen one and it was factory and among the last of the M's. There was an aftermarket disk brake setup available for earlier M's made by Lambert. Regular IH disk brakes from a Super M will not bolt up to a M unless it's one of the last ones.

Live PTO means when you mash the clutch, the PTO continues to run, the PTO is independent of the clutch. Factory live PTO was not available until the Super MTA. M&W offered an attachment which would make a standard PTO, as in a M or Super M, "live" or at least so when you press the clutch the PTO could keep running.

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Postby Festus » Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:05 am

As far as the live PTO - I remember as a kid the Super H I have had a clutch in the rear housing that the pto shaft extends from. It was a live power of sorts it seems to me. There was a problem with it many years ago and evidently it was replaced with the shaft and housing from a donor H. Was this the B&M product or was it factory IH? I would love to have this set up back on The Super H!

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