Charging system 1952 cub

[CharlieK]

electrical problems are a headache some times

[Jim Becker]

Since there is another thread going on about a similar problem, it is a little hard to keep track of what is going on in this specific case. But this seems to be what we have so far:

1) The tractor is a 1952, but that is irrelevant because of #2.
2) The entire electrical system, including the distributor has been stripped off and replaced with components from an earlier tractor, including a magneto.
3) The tank/hood has been replaced with an earlier ('47-'49) version, maybe from the same tractor as the electrical components.
4) The cutout, which would have matched the existing generator has been replaced with a later regulator designed to replace a cutout.
5) The replacement regulator is held on by a hose clamp rather than two screws as designed. This almost guarantees a poor ground connection for the regulator.
6) The 4-position light switch, part of the '47-'49 components, has been replaced with a 3-position switch. This is okay because of #4.

This is what you should do next:
1) Cleanup and verify contact of all electrical connections, paying particular attention to the grounds. The most obvious concern is the grounding of the regulator onto the generator. There should be two existing tapped holes in the generator for attaching the regulator. Don't use screws any longer than needed. They should not be longer than the thickness of the generator shell.
2) Check to see if it now charges. If not, go through the troubleshooting chart that tst posted.

[Glen]

Maybe I need to focus my question.
1. Is the Delco 1100501 generator designed for a voltage regulator instead of a cut out relay?
2. Is the correct location of the voltage regulator below the generator on a mounting plate? Tm sells that plate but it seems pretty simple

Hi,
1. Yes, the Delco model number 1100501 is the generator IH used with the voltage regulator, from when they began using the regulator, at serial number 115403, which was during 1950, until during 1956, when they changed to the next model number of gen that they used.
It is what my Cub has.

2. Yes, the regulator goes on a mounting plate beside or below the gen.
The plate TM sells is the right one. The plate goes on below the gen mounting bracket, so the bracket is on top of the plate, with the curve down. That is so the hood will not hit on the top of the regulator.
Be sure the 2 mounting bolts that hold it on the engine are long enough.

I posted a page from the 1955 Cub operator's manual in my post on page 1 of this post, showing with the hood off, it shows the regulator mounting.
The 1952 Cub operator's manual shows it also.

The part in your pics is a voltage regulator. It looks like the original style that IH used on Cubs in those years, but I can't see the mounting of it too well in your pics.
If it has the curved mounting to fit on top of a gen made on it, it has been replaced, that style wasn't original.

The regulator should have a flat base for 2 bolts, like the mounting plate has.
The original regulators had the Gen post under it, that is so the wire would be out of the rain, or out of sight when installed on the plate.
The regulator originally faces with the 3 posts in toward the engine, so the wires are not seen.
The bottom wire goes under the reg, so it is not seen.
Be careful with the wire routing, be sure none of them rub on the throttle rod going to the governor.
The rod moves, and eventually it could wear into the wires.

The F and A wires from the gen to the regulator go around the left side of the gen, and follow its shape, curving down and around under the gen, to the regulator. Make them the right length if you are making your own wires.
Make them a little longer, so the gen can move out from the engine if the belt wears, and you need to adjust it out.
You should have a gen belt that makes the gen in on the adjustment slot, so it can be moved out as the belt wears.

Your Cub could have come new with the magneto, they were available then.
Or someone could have changed it to a magneto.

The 3 position light switch is supposed to be on a 1952 Cub, they were used from serial number 115403 until 210000.

Like Jim said, the hood has evidently been replaced with one for a Cub older than yours.
A 1952 Cub originally has the short ear dash.

Below is a pic from Brillman, I think, of a Cub voltage regulator showing the mounting.
It has the Gen post on the side, that is the newer way they are made.
The post under the reg is nice, it keeps rain off it.

[Eugene]

Consider a 12 volt single wire alternator.

Can be installed for about the same price as a quality voltage regulator. Tractor is much simpler, dirt simple, to wire. Less headache than trying to figure out the current trctor's wiring.

[Workinprogress]

Success!!!!!!!!

I cleaned up the armature on the generator. Did the spin test with the generator using jumper cables and the 6 volt battery. Generator spun when given power. I walked around the tractor and noticed a wire in the regulator was broken! See photo below.

I rigged up a temporary wire to test. Everything works! Amp meter was reading over 10 at 3/4 throttle!

[tst]

cool

[Workinprogress]

Well the fun never ends!

After fixing the wire in the regulator I got 10 amps on the amp gauge but I only ran the tractor for a couple minutes. Follow up test drives found sporadic output.

I went through and removed everything including the generator mounting brackets. Cleaned all surfaces with a wire brush on my grinder. Reinstalled everything including additions ground for the regulator. Output still sporadic.

Removed generator and disassembled. Found some internal issues. One of the bare wires for the field coil was touching the generator housings. Also found bent brush holder. While straightening the brush holder the small tab broke off that holds the brush

On that generator all three brush brackets are riveted to a frame.

So looking like I have a few options.
option 1 put $ into a potentially questionable generator. Not sure of cost of replacing brush bracket.
Option 2 continue to use magento but install 12 volt single wire generator.

[Mht]

If it were mine and I was going to depend on it at all I’d stick with the magneto, install 12 volt single wire alternator, 12 volt battery and never look back

[Eugene]

If it were mine and I was going to depend on it at all I’d stick with the magneto, install 12 volt single wire alternator, 12 volt battery and never look back

Yup. Operate the magneto until the coil fails, then convert using the magneto points to battery powered ignition.

[staninlowerAL]

Agree, the best of both situations. Magneto for running engine, 12v alternator/battery for charging, starting, accessories, etc.

[Workinprogress]

Thanks for the input.

Seems like that Napa RAY 2134011SW is one of the standard Options people use for the upgrade. Price isn’t bad $73+core. The mounting bracket seems pretty simple in design so pretty sure I can fab one up with metal around the garage. Any suggestions on metal thickness?

Parts list for upgrade:
1) Generator
2) Mounting bracket
3) 12 volt battery
4) Maybe new belt if length changed
5) Electrical wire - generator to amp gauge and amp gauge to starter/battery
6) new amp gauge(?) current one only goes to 20
7) 12 volt light bulbs for headlights

Anything I am missing?

[staninlowerAL]

Depending on which alternator you get you might have to re-clock in so the mounting/brace points are in the right location for maximum hood clearance. Some people take the short route and cut out a slot in the hood. IMO, BAD IDEA!!!!!

[Eugene]

Price isn’t bad $73+core.

Check prices elsewhere. Probably cheaper on the internet.

Save your old generator. You may need to move the generator pulley to the alternator. That is if you purchase a Delco clone.

[staninlowerAL]

Ebay, One wire, about $40, no core, free shipping, self exciting, internal regulator, no pulley swap, charges at low RPM.

[Workinprogress]

Been pricing out some different alternators. Found a couple at rock auto

Reman
PURE ENERGY 7127109 - $36+sh
PURE ENERGY 7127SW3 - $42+sh
ACDELCO 3342114 - $42+sh

New
~$55 + sh

Anything specific I should be looking for or looking to avoid?