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Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 440
- Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:54 pm
- Zip Code: 27858
- Tractors Owned: 1964 Farmall Cub Red Square Nose # 223883 one of 2300 built before they switch to Yellow and White.
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Just a Clean Strong run of the mill Farmall 140 with very little Wear.
Also have a bit of equipment
Woods C-42 Belly mower, 1963 IH McCormick #215 Plow, IH #144 Cultivators, IH Side Dresser (in need of some work non working at the moment) - Location: Greenville N.C
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
but if i were to put a alternator oh say 2 wire Delco would i over lap wire's or?? any photo's would help big time cause im up Sh** Creek as far as find a good regulator cause i don't feel like wasting 200$ for nothing. Any photos of someones Cub with a Delco alternator hooked up would help big time an which wire's i remove or replace with new one's Thanks
(Sry for posting the S word) just the way it seems now to me.
(Sry for posting the S word) just the way it seems now to me.
Tractors are like watermelons..Eat the red and throw away the green!!
Brendan Dixon Greenville NC
1964 Farmall Cub #223883
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Tractorguy140, YouTube
Brendan Dixon Greenville NC
1964 Farmall Cub #223883
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Tractorguy140, YouTube
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 2929
- Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2009 9:51 pm
- Zip Code: 63664
- Location: MO, Potosi
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Brendan,
Before I spent any MONEY on it the first thing I would do with that regulator is spend some TIME on it and follow Clark's advice earlier in this thread. Disconnect the battery and clean every regulator connection one at a time so it is bright and shining metal to metal contact on the tab and on the wire end. The pictures show just enough rust to be causing problems. I would also clean both regulator mounting pads and where they touch the tractor so they are bright and shining. Then do the other ends of all the wires. Doing the battery cables, both ends of each, won't hurt either. If you have replacement ends on the battery cables, take them loose and clean the exposed wires and inside the wire clamp. Hook the battery back up and polarize the generator. You wont be out a dime and could very possibly have a working charging system.
If your battery ground bolts to the battery box make sure it is getting good metal to metal contact to the tractor frame. Saw one bolted to the box and the box was so rusted I could lift it up around the battery. Gravity and rust was the only connection. Guy couldn't figure out why he was having starting and charging problems.
10 page Delco-Remy Service bulletin on regulators from 2-27-1953 even tells one difference in positive and negative ground regulators. (page 6 "Cleaning Contact Points" paragraph for the impatient)
http://www.stinsonclub.org/PublicTech/YahooGroup/Delco-Remy%201R-116%20(regulator).pdf
I haven't looked at enough old regulators to know if they are basically all made from the exact same parts or if there are an infinite number of differences that all end up doing the same job.
Before I spent any MONEY on it the first thing I would do with that regulator is spend some TIME on it and follow Clark's advice earlier in this thread. Disconnect the battery and clean every regulator connection one at a time so it is bright and shining metal to metal contact on the tab and on the wire end. The pictures show just enough rust to be causing problems. I would also clean both regulator mounting pads and where they touch the tractor so they are bright and shining. Then do the other ends of all the wires. Doing the battery cables, both ends of each, won't hurt either. If you have replacement ends on the battery cables, take them loose and clean the exposed wires and inside the wire clamp. Hook the battery back up and polarize the generator. You wont be out a dime and could very possibly have a working charging system.
If your battery ground bolts to the battery box make sure it is getting good metal to metal contact to the tractor frame. Saw one bolted to the box and the box was so rusted I could lift it up around the battery. Gravity and rust was the only connection. Guy couldn't figure out why he was having starting and charging problems.
I've seen this before, thought I'd saved it, couldn't find it, Googled it.Xperimental wrote:.............. I have asked before in another thread if a good schematic of the 6V positive ground regulator used on IH tractors is available. I found a diagram that shows the circuit but not any of the resistance values. I have enough old regulators that I can probably fill in the values by measuring. I would like to see if I can repair any of my original regulators, since they seem to be better units than anything I can find.
10 page Delco-Remy Service bulletin on regulators from 2-27-1953 even tells one difference in positive and negative ground regulators. (page 6 "Cleaning Contact Points" paragraph for the impatient)
http://www.stinsonclub.org/PublicTech/YahooGroup/Delco-Remy%201R-116%20(regulator).pdf
I haven't looked at enough old regulators to know if they are basically all made from the exact same parts or if there are an infinite number of differences that all end up doing the same job.
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 24
- Joined: Wed Sep 11, 2013 12:51 am
- Zip Code: 05701
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
I only have 10 hours on my 1964 6v cub, but it starts every time. I do keep a battery charger handy but it hasn't let me down. I've started her in 30 VT weather, and no problem. I let her warm up for a few minutes before I do anything. A 12v conversion would be a waste for me right now.
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 3369
- Joined: Mon Feb 17, 2003 8:48 pm
- Zip Code: 28081
- Circle of Safety: Y
- Location: NC, Kannapolis
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Make sure the ground wire on the side of the regulator has a good solder joint. That was the problem when my 63 stopped charging.
"I'd rather be a mechanic in the shop"- Henry Ford
252646 & 221525. 195897 (Gone, but not forgotten)
252646 & 221525. 195897 (Gone, but not forgotten)
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 5234
- Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:53 am
- Zip Code: 28521
- Tractors Owned: Collector of Super As, Corn Pickers, and a buncha other junk. Even a Cub now and then...
- Circle of Safety: Y
- Location: NC, Jacksonville area
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Scrivet wrote:Brendan,
Before I spent any MONEY on it the first thing I would do with that regulator is spend some TIME on it and follow Clark's advice earlier in this thread. Disconnect the battery and clean every regulator connection one at a time so it is bright and shining metal to metal contact on the tab and on the wire end. The pictures show just enough rust to be causing problems. I would also clean both regulator mounting pads and where they touch the tractor so they are bright and shining. Then do the other ends of all the wires. Doing the battery cables, both ends of each, won't hurt either. If you have replacement ends on the battery cables, take them loose and clean the exposed wires and inside the wire clamp. Hook the battery back up and polarize the generator. You wont be out a dime and could very possibly have a working charging system.
If your battery ground bolts to the battery box make sure it is getting good metal to metal contact to the tractor frame. Saw one bolted to the box and the box was so rusted I could lift it up around the battery. Gravity and rust was the only connection. Guy couldn't figure out why he was having starting and charging problems.
Brendan I'm having a brain @#@# and can't remember for sure but isn't this one of the last 6V Farmall Cubs? If so, you just answered your own question. Follow Scrivet's advice and keep it original. Despite what a lot of people say, 6v systems are fine if you're willing to spend a little time to get 'em right.
Al
White Demo Super A Restoration Updates
Let us pray for farmers and all who prepare the soil for planting, that the seeds they sow may lead to a bountiful harvest.
Celebrating 75 years of the Super A: 1947-2022
Let us pray for farmers and all who prepare the soil for planting, that the seeds they sow may lead to a bountiful harvest.
Celebrating 75 years of the Super A: 1947-2022
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 440
- Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:54 pm
- Zip Code: 27858
- Tractors Owned: 1964 Farmall Cub Red Square Nose # 223883 one of 2300 built before they switch to Yellow and White.
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Just a Clean Strong run of the mill Farmall 140 with very little Wear.
Also have a bit of equipment
Woods C-42 Belly mower, 1963 IH McCormick #215 Plow, IH #144 Cultivators, IH Side Dresser (in need of some work non working at the moment) - Location: Greenville N.C
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Dang gone Maybe i should keep it original Shoot everything is there in good shape Ah ill wait awhile till spring or so me an my dad will take the Gen an regulator to a repair shop an see if we can get both redone an try an polarize it. But! this is just really difficult finding the right parts an for one getting it to work correct might just set it up 12 volt an forget the six! im not really worried if it not original or not i just want it to charge crank an have no troubles! time will tell
Tractors are like watermelons..Eat the red and throw away the green!!
Brendan Dixon Greenville NC
1964 Farmall Cub #223883
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Tractorguy140, YouTube
Brendan Dixon Greenville NC
1964 Farmall Cub #223883
1964 Farmall 140 #27512
Tractorguy140, YouTube
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:04 am
- Zip Code: 74011
- Tractors Owned: -
1958 F Cub with Woods 42C
1962 LoBoy with FH & Mott Flail - Location: Broken Arrow, OK
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
I converted mine to 12v because by the looks of the generator it wouldn't even make a good anchor and the wiring was awful. Now I just touch the starter and it fires up. 6v to 12v night and day in my opinion. I think it all cost me around $200. That covered the alternator, petronix kit, wires and fittings, resistor, coil, new bulbs, and a 12v light switch.
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 318
- Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2008 8:16 pm
- Zip Code: 44483
- Circle of Safety: Y
- Location: OH
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
I like mine left original.All of my tractors are 6 volt. They have made it 60 + years and work fine.
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- Cub Pro
- Posts: 23701
- Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2003 2:09 pm
- Zip Code: 63664
- Tractors Owned: 47, 48, 49 cub plus Wagner loader & other attachments. 41 Farmall H.
- Location: Mo, Potosi
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Mine are all still original, simply because I have never had any reason to convert. I have only had one generator that was beyond my ability to repair, and since it had a fairly new battery I paid the $80 to have a shop rebuild it. If I had a generator that was not repairable, combined with a weak battery I would probably have gone the alternator route. There are times it would be nice to have a 12 volt source on the tractor, but I have a jumper pack that will do that. A well maintained system will start just fine either way, so in the end it comes down to your personal preference.
If you are not part of the solution,
you are part of the problem!!!
you are part of the problem!!!
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 1421
- Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2006 2:54 pm
- Zip Code: 60073
- Circle of Safety: Y
- Location: IL, Round Lake Heights
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
I agree with Scrivet. Spend some time checking the connections, and also the air gaps in side the regulator. I was also through regulators at about every other year, but fortunately, I saved my old ones. When the last one died, I decided to pull it apart and check the gap. It was out of spec, and after I adjusted it, Eddie was charging her battery again. The others were also out of spec, so I adjusted them as well. I swapped the first one I adjusted out for another, and it works as well. Have not tried the third yet. However, it's been nearly three years since I put the second adjusted one in, and (touch wood) she's still charging.
FWIW, I have bought both the expensive and not-so-expensive (but still not cheap) NAPA VRs, and they each lasted about the same length of time.
FWIW, I have bought both the expensive and not-so-expensive (but still not cheap) NAPA VRs, and they each lasted about the same length of time.
Michael Cummings
Eddie - a 1959 International Lo-Boy named after my father in law, who who bought her new.
Eddie - a 1959 International Lo-Boy named after my father in law, who who bought her new.
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 2917
- Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:26 pm
- Location: NC
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Musings on voltage regulators: I have seen lots of instances of problems with voltage regulators on vehicles with generators. But have not experienced those problems on vehicles with which I was associated. 1950 Chevrolet (6 volt) bought new, kept for 2 years. 1952 Chevrolet (6 volt) bought new, kept for 6 years. 1958 Chevrolet (12 volt), kept for 4 years. 1957 Chevrolet (12 volt) bought used, kept for 4 years. 1950 Chevrolet (6 volt) truck, bought well-worn, kept for 1 year. 1954 Chevrolet (6 volt) truck, kept for 4 years. those are the ones with Delco charging systems. Never a regulator problem with any of those.
I do suspect that the quality of regulators has declined-- probably the material used for the contact points is now inferior. Another suspicion is that the regulators proving to be most troublesome may be mounted so that they are subject to vibration-- which I believe would be very bad. All the vehicles mentioned above had the regulator mounted on the body, mostly on the firewall, not on the engine.
I do suspect that the quality of regulators has declined-- probably the material used for the contact points is now inferior. Another suspicion is that the regulators proving to be most troublesome may be mounted so that they are subject to vibration-- which I believe would be very bad. All the vehicles mentioned above had the regulator mounted on the body, mostly on the firewall, not on the engine.
Luck favors those who are prepared
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 2917
- Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2006 5:26 pm
- Location: NC
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Almost off subject, I found several listings at various prices for this "device". Based on what I believe I know about electricity, this is absolutely worthless. No way can it accomplish any of the stated claims. Save your money.
But perhaps I could be proven wrong in this case.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-EFFICIENCY ... c9&vxp=mtr
I was searching for a 3-coil Delco regulator that could be bought cheap to be converted to electronics. 6 or 12 volt, either is usable. Non-functioning is just fine as the coils will be removed and discarded. None of those on eBay fit the financial situation I envisioned.
But perhaps I could be proven wrong in this case.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-EFFICIENCY ... c9&vxp=mtr
I was searching for a 3-coil Delco regulator that could be bought cheap to be converted to electronics. 6 or 12 volt, either is usable. Non-functioning is just fine as the coils will be removed and discarded. None of those on eBay fit the financial situation I envisioned.
Luck favors those who are prepared
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- 10+ Years
- Posts: 159
- Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:41 pm
- Zip Code: 47359
- Tractors Owned: Farmall 200
1956 Farmall Cub
1961 Farmall Cub
Farmall 460D
International 656D Hi-Clear
Farmall 806D
Allis Chalmers 5020 - Location: Blackford County, Indiana
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
Bus Driver wrote:Almost off subject, I found several listings at various prices for this "device". Based on what I believe I know about electricity, this is absolutely worthless. No way can it accomplish any of the stated claims. Save your money.
But perhaps I could be proven wrong in this case.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HIGH-EFFICIENCY ... c9&vxp=mtr
I was searching for a 3-coil Delco regulator that could be bought cheap to be converted to electronics. 6 or 12 volt, either is usable. Non-functioning is just fine as the coils will be removed and discarded. None of those on eBay fit the financial situation I envisioned.
At first glance, I would have to agree. It has only two connections which are apparently positive and negative, yet professional installation is recommended and no instructions included. Pretty baffling. I wonder if it is some sort of capacitor-resistor circuit. I would like to hear about your electronic conversion though.
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- Team Cub
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- Location: MN
Re: Alternator conversion? or keep the 6 Volt
My bet is that the wire into that thing is also the wire coming back out. If anything, it may pass through a ferrite ring that acts as a choke.
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